ANSWERS: 6
  • Those credible sources will prove that 586 fails to allow certain prophecies to come true. 607 is the only date that works. See: http://www.jehovahsjudgment.co.uk/607/default.html for in depth information on the subject. -------- Edit: Addition: Here is the Conclusion to that report: Here are the failed prophecies if 587 BCE is the correct date for Jerusalem's destruction. Jerusalem uninhabited and in ruins for 70 years. (This prophecy fails if date is 587 or 586) If 587 BCE is correct, then the desolation ends in 517 BCE. By this time homes had been built and crops grown for over 20 years (Haggai 1:4, 11). Alternatively, if the desolation ends in 537 BCE, the period is only 50 years, not 70. Alternatively, if the period began in 3rd year of Jehoiakim, the desolation is only 68 years, not 70, and whole passages of Jeremiah are wrong. No matter what argument is used, the prophecy fails. 70 years of the nations servitude to Babylon, starting with Nebuchadnezzar (This prophecy fails if date is 587 or 586) If 70 years begin in Jehoiakim's 3rd year of rulership, servitude lasts 68 years, not 70. If servitude begins in 609 BCE (secular chronology) with the defeat of Assyria, Nebuchadnezzar is not King for another 2 years, but prophecies state nations serve him and not his father; once King, servitude lasts 68 years, not 70. Tyre forgotten for 70 years. (This prophecy fails if date is 587 or 586) Period begins after the destruction of Jerusalem (Ezekiel 26:1), which is 587 BCE at the earliest. Period ends when Tyre's profit becomes holy to Jehovah (Isaiah 23:14), in 537 BCE (Ezra 3:1). Only 50 years have passed, not 70. Egypt devastated for 40 years. (This prophecy fails if date is 587 or 586) Ezekiel gave prophecy in 570 BCE (Ezekiel 29:17) and devastation begins in 568 BCE. Within 30 years Egypt has a King and holds a foreign alliance, and all exiles were released from Babylon, also Kingdom strong enough to rebuff Persian Empire. The 40-year period ends uneventfully in 528 BCE. However, the 607 BCE date fits all the chronologies and prophecies like a glove! It creates no contradictions, no failed prophecies, and requires no complex arguments or contrived explanations. All one needs to do is accept what the Bible plainly says, that 70 years is 70 years long. 607 BCE – the only date that works Here is the result when we accept the Bible's mathematics — that 70 years is 70 years long: Jerusalem uninhabited and in ruins for 70 years. (This prophecy passes if 607 is the date) If 607 BCE is correct, then the desolation ends right on time in 537 BCE when the Jews are back in their cities. 70 years of the nations servitude to Nebuchadnezzar (This prophecy passes if 607 is the date) If 70 years begin in 607 BCE, servitude lasts the full 70 years. Nebuchadnezzar is King at start as prophecies stated. Tyre forgotten for 70 years. (This prophecy passes if 607 is the date) Period begins after the destruction of Jerusalem (Ezekiel 26:1), which is 607 BCE. Period ends precisely 70 years later when Tyre's profit becomes holy to Jehovah (Isaiah 23:14), in 537 BCE (Ezra 3:1) when Tyre provides materials for the new temple. Egypt devastated for 40 years. (This prophecy passes if 607 is the date) Ezekiel gave prophecy in 590 BCE (Ezekiel 29:17) and devastation begins in 588 BCE, ends exactly 40 years later in 548 BCE. A year later secular chronology records Egypt's King holding a foreign alliance. The date 607 BCE is the only date which fits — and not only does it fit, but it fits extremely well. If one is “searching for truth”, as many 587-promoters claim to be doing, shouldn't one only abandon 607 BCE if there is a better explanation? Is 587 a better explanation? Does it harmonize with the Bible in a better way than 607? Most certainly not! —See the summary chart below.
  • They use the flawed teachings of Rutherford & others who ASSUMED Christ would come back in 1914, 1940+, 1977 etc... THe calculations remind me of the Seventh Day Adventists prophetess & her screw ups.
  • If you look at the time line that the JW's follow against secular scholars you'll see that there are about 20 years missing from the JW time line of the kings of Babylon, I highly doubt that the people of Babylon would go 1 year without a king (you know someone would step up and say, I was the cousin of so and so, so I should be king) Here is he way it falls, you judge, why do the JW's start leaving out the time when the king served I wonder? Nebuchadnezzar ruled 43 years from 624 to 582 per Insight 2 pp.480-481 (624-19=605, not the same as 607 per the nineteenth year of Nebuchadnezzar mentioned in 2 Kings 25:8 but I could be wrong here) Evil-Merodach Ruled 2 years starting in 581 per Insight 1 p.453 but no end date listed so I calculated it to be 579 (581-581=579) Neriglissar ruled 4 years per WT 1-1-65 p.29 no dates given so I calculated 579 to 575 (579-4=575) Labashi-Marduk ruled 9 months per WT 1-1-65 p.29 so this could have been 575 or 574 depending There are 18 or 19 missing years here that I’m confused about. Nabonidus ruled 17 years per Insight 2 p.457 from 556-539 Others believe this time line: Nebuchadnezzar ruled 43 years from 604 to 562 Evil-Merodach Ruled 2 years starting in 561-560 Neriglissar ruled 4 years 559-556 Labashi-Marduk ruled 9 months 556 Nabonidus ruled 17 years from 555-539 (this is just one year different than stated in the Jehovah Witness Insight 2 p.457) Calculating back from Nabonidus’ rule to Nebuchadnezzar’s rule this time line seems to be the more accurate unless the 18 or 19 missing years can be explained. Thus putting the date of the fall of Jerusalem more around the year 604-19=585
  • (For the sake of full disclosure, I have been one of Jehovah's Witnesses for nearly 40 years.)It's interesting that there is so much discussion over this one subject. Since i first became aware of it some months ago, i have asked many church-going people (probably nearly a hundred) "When do you think Babylon overthrew Jerusalem? All i've gotten is blank stares. Some think that Babylon is a fictional space station and others "haven't been listening to the news about the Middle East". It seems that the only religious people who have heard of such a thing or care are Witnesses and those who oppose our message. Ask your priest or pastor to explain these events and the Gentile times to you in depth and see what you find out. Over the years, in my study of language, history and prophecy, i've found the Witnesses to be either right on the mark or pretty close. True, in matters of prophecy we come to understand things more clearly as the prophecies unfold. Here's my suggestion: Take a good hard look at what we teach and do. Attend a large convention or a number of congregation meetings. Examine the worldwide loving brotherhood we enjoy, free of sectarian violence, bigotry or national and ethnic hate. See how people's lives change for the better when they accept the Bible's moral standards. Notice how our complete explanation of the Scriptures is consistent, not only with itself, but with God's Word as a whole. After that, if the understanding of a particular chronology still bothers you extremely, pray for guidance and ask yourself if it's really that important. If i were to learn beyond doubt that the dates 607 and 1914 are wrong, i would patiently wait to see how it all plays out because, regardless of dates and interpretation of prophecy, i know that i'm still in the best place, with people who genuinely love the Creator and are serving Him the best they know how. If these dates are correct (as i truly believe), it will prove out. If it turns out that they aren't, we will find that out at the right time. True Christians are eager to see prophecy fulfilled and will risk being wrong on certain fine points. When you are eagerly expecting a much awaited guest, you look out the window or jump up every time a car passes. Better to be too expectant than to sleep. Much technical information has gone back and forth, but it seems to me that this is what it all comes down to-faith in God and love for our neighbors. Are we always right about prophecy? No, not at all. Is anyone else doing better? If so, please tell me. If they can combine spot-on interpretation with the love, unity, zeal and preaching of Jehovah's Witnesses, i surely want to know about it. Thank you.
  • Absolutely! Perhaps this detailed answer at http://www.answerbag.com/a_view/986939 will help.
  • May 8, 1972 Awake magazine “Your Word Is Truth” When Did Babylon Desolate Jerusalem? SECULAR historians usually give the year 586 B.C.E. as the correct date for the desolation of Jerusalem. Why, then, do Jehovah’s Christian witnesses speak of this event as occurring in 607 B.C.E.? It is because of confidence in what the Bible says about the duration of Jerusalem’s lying desolate. The Scriptures assign a period of seventy years to the desolation of Judah and Jerusalem. After describing the Babylonian conquest of Jerusalem, 2 Chronicles 36:21 reports: “All the days of lying desolated it kept sabbath, to fulfill seventy years.” By means of his prophet Jeremiah, Jehovah had declared: “All this land must become a devastated place, an object of astonishment, and these nations will have to serve the king of Babylon seventy years.”—Jer. 25:11. Was this really a period of seventy literal years? Yes, that is the way the prophet Daniel, toward the close of the period of Jerusalem’s desolation, understood it, saying: “I myself, Daniel, discerned by the books the number of the years concerning which the word of Jehovah had occurred to Jeremiah the prophet, for fulfilling the devastations of Jerusalem, namely, seventy years.” (Dan. 9:2) Note that here Daniel speaks of the “number of the years” of devastation as seventy. Surely he could not have done so if the seventy years were symbolic or an inflated round number. Additional evidence is provided in the book of Zechariah. We read: “When you fasted and there was a wailing in the fifth month and in the seventh month, and this for seventy years, did you really fast to me, even me?” (Zech. 7:5; 1:12) The way this question is framed, with reference to specific months, certainly indicates that a period of seventy literal years was involved. That the Jews in ancient times understood the seventy years as being literal and involving a total devastation of the land is apparent from the works of Josephus, a Jewish historian. In his Antiquities of the Jews, Book X, chap. 9, par. 7, he tells that “all Judea and Jerusalem, and the temple, continued to be a desert for seventy years.” When the Israelites were able to return to Judah and Jerusalem, that desolation ended. There is general agreement that Babylon fell to Cyrus on October 5/6, 539 B.C.E. From the Scriptural record at 2 Chronicles 36:21-23 and Ezra 3:1-3, which tells of Cyrus’ decree liberating the Jews and their return to their homeland, the indications are that the Jews arrived back in their homeland around the early part of October of 537 B.C.E., ending the seventy years of desolation. Jerusalem must, therefore, have been destroyed seventy years earlier, in 607 B.C.E. Various attempts to harmonize the date 586 B.C.E. with what the Bible says are therefore unsatisfactory. None of such attempts fit the Bible’s testimony that Jerusalem and Judah lay desolate for seventy years. The 586 B.C.E. date is based primarily on what is known as “Ptolemy’s Canon,” which assigns a total of 87 years to the Babylonian dynasty beginning with Nabopolassar and ending with Nabonidus at the fall of Babylon in 539 B.C.E. According to this Canon, the five kings that ruled during this period were Nabopolassar (21 years), Nebuchadnezzar (43 years), Evil-merodach (2 years), Neriglissar (4 years) and Nabonidus (17 years). In line with the number of years thus assigned to each ruler, Jerusalem’s desolation in Nebuchadnezzar’s eighteenth year (nineteenth year if counting from his “accession year”) would fall in 586 B.C.E.—2 Ki. 25:8; Jer. 52:29. But how dependable is Ptolemy’s Canon? In his book The Mysterious Numbers of the Hebrew Kings, Professor E. R. Thiele writes: “Ptolemy’s canon was prepared primarily for astronomical, not historical, purposes. It did not pretend to give a complete list of all the rulers of either Babylon or Persia, nor the exact month or day of the beginning of their reigns, but it was a device which made possible the correct allocation into a broad chronological scheme of certain astronomical data which were then available. Kings whose reigns were less than a year and which did not embrace the New Year’s day were not mentioned.” (Italics ours.) So the very purpose of the Canon makes absolute dating by means of it impossible. There is no way to be sure that Ptolemy was correct in assigning a certain number of years to various kings. For example, while Ptolemy credits Evil-merodach with only two years of rule, Polyhistor assigns him twelve years. Then, too, one cannot be certain that just five kings ruled during this period. At Borsippa, for instance, were found names of a number of Babylonian kings that do not appear elsewhere. Nevertheless, someone may ask, Is there not an ancient astronomical tablet, “VAT 4956,” that places the thirty-seventh year of Nebuchadnezzar’s reign exactly in the same year as does Ptolemy’s Canon? It should not be overlooked that the source of corroborative evidence should bear the earmarks of dependability. Can this be said about “VAT 4956”? Not really. The text is not an original and it contains numerous gaps. Certain terms found therein cannot even be understood now. Twice in the text the notation hi-bi (meaning “broken off, obliterated”) appears. Thereby the scribe acknowledged that he was working from a defective copy. Even if, despite these problems, the astronomical information presents a true picture of the original, this would not establish the correctness of the historical data. As Ptolemy used the reigns of ancient kings (as he understood them) simply as a framework in which to place astronomical data, so the copyist of “VAT 4956” may, in line with the chronology accepted in his time, have inserted the ‘thirty-seventh year of Nebuchadnezzar.’ As admitted by the German scholars Neugebauer and Weidner (the translators of this text), the scribe evidently changed words to conform with the abbreviated terminology common in his day. But he was both inconsistent and inaccurate. So he could just as easily have inserted other information to suit his purposes. Hence both Ptolemy’s Canon and “VAT 4956” might even have been derived from the same basic source. They could share mutual errors. Opposed to Ptolemy’s Canon and “VAT 4956” stands the unanimous testimony of Jeremiah, Zechariah, Daniel and the writer of 2 Chronicles, that Judah and Jerusalem lay desolate for seventy years. Thousands of ancient manuscripts of these writings contain the identical testimony. So, because of the problems inherent in Ptolemy’s Canon and “VAT 4956,” it takes more faith to accept them than it does to accept the Bible’s testimony, which would place the desolation of Jerusalem by the Babylonians in 607 B.C.E. It is apparant that most agree that Babylon was defeated in 539 B.C.E. and that the Jews returned to Jerusalem in 537 B.C.E. So I guess the question is if we believe that it was a 70 year captivity as the Bible says or a 49-50 year as most secular historians that follow Ptolemy's Canon or the "VAT 4956" would have us believe. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/530s_BC http://www.towards-success.com/dejnarde_files/fulfilled_prophecy.htm http://dic.academic.ru/dic.nsf/enwiki/21294 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=2Chron36:21;Jer25:11;Dan9:2;Zech7:5;Zech1:12;&version=49;16;15;51;8; http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=2Chron36:21-23;Ezra3:1-3;2Kings25:8;Jer52:29;&version=49;16;15;51;8; But how dependable is Ptolemy's Canon? In his book The Mysterious Numbers of the Hebrew Kings, Professor E. R. Thiele writes: “Ptolemy's canon was prepared primarily for astronomical, not historical, purposes. It did not pretend to give a complete list of all the rulers of either Babylon or Persia, nor the exact month or day of the beginning of their reigns, but it was a device which made possible the correct allocation into a broad chronological scheme of certain astronomical data which were then available. Kings whose reigns were less than a year and which did not embrace the New Year's day were not mentioned.” So the very purpose of the Canon makes absolute dating by means of it impossible. There is no way to be sure that Ptolemy was correct in assigning a certain number of years to various kings. For example, while Ptolemy credits Evil-merodach with only two years of rule, Polyhistor assigns him twelve years. Then, too, one cannot be certain that just five kings ruled during this period. At Borsippa, for instance, were found names of a number of Babylonian kings that do not appear elsewhere.

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