Are the guys of the armed forces really disciplined or is it just the discipline forced upon them?

Thanks a lot.The answer and embedded thought as really admirable.

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by engineer is Terminator on June 1st, 2009

Girls of armed forces are not that troubled.I have personally known a lot and yeah,there are exceptions.

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by engineer is Terminator on June 1st, 2009

engineer I am not following what you just posted. "GIRLS of armed forces are not that troubled"?

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by Eileen on June 2nd, 2009

Indeed.Girls who join armed forces come with more determination than guys.You'll see less number of dropouts among girls than guys from military camps.

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by engineer is Terminator on June 2nd, 2009

There are fewer "woman" in the armed forces then men, I assure you the determination on both parties are equal. And I am not understanding the "dropout" you speak of? You just dont drop out of the military. Anyways discipline for some is a learned process, if you have little (men or women)going into military you sure as hell learn it quickly!
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I thank you for your explaination of meaning. Yet in the Armed Forces of todays world there is little distinction between male and female unless you talking NAVY SEALS to which females will never be permitted.

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by Eileen on June 2nd, 2009

I'm talking of discipline and determination.I've noticed a lot of guys joining the boot camp and getting kicked off from there in a month or so.They take it as a vacation time and to fund their college education.I have a friend of mine who was kicked off in the 3rd month of joining due to his behavior problems,where as I've seen girls give it all over there and emerge out hitting the right slot in right time.

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by engineer is Terminator on June 2nd, 2009

Thanks.My wishes.

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by engineer is Terminator on June 1st, 2009

Indeed.Thanks,Suby.

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by engineer is Terminator on May 30th, 2009

Bar room brawls involving sailors is largely overblown. As a former sailor, I traveled quite a bit. Never did I see or get involved in a bar fight. In fact, most of my time when on delightful shore patrol duty I encountered few sailors or marines getting into trouble. Sometimes there would be a few that had too much to drink, but I'd just tell them to return to the ship for their own good.

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by Son of Cleaver on May 31st, 2009

When I wrote about the waterfront brawls I didn't really mean the modern navy or sailors. Till a few centuries back sailors used to behave somewhat differently at waterfronts, thats all I meant.
My only occasion to read about what sailors do when they land at a harbor at a city is from reading the antics of the crew of the nuclear-powered aircraft carrier USS Nimitz to the Chennai harbor in July, 2007. They did great social work during the day which got full coverage in all news media. But they did behave like sailors of yore after sunset, from the news paper reports I got to read. No trouble caused to anyone or anything like that.
This not to say that there was anything improper, but the stresses of having lived at sea over a long period were relieved by many of them during the short stay at a port of call on a goodwill visit.
My comment is not to make any insinuation but to give a reply to your comment. "Sailors are Sailors" was what the papers said on the day the ship left Chennai.

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by Suby the Coat on May 31st, 2009

I understand your feeling and appreciate it a lot but,could you make me know the difference of forcing discipline on someone and discipline being drilled into someone.Both sounds the same to me.

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by engineer is Terminator on May 30th, 2009

Looked up in the Thesaurus Dictionary (synonyms) the difference between forced and drilled. These are the some of the synonyms given for forced: strained, unnatural, artificial, mandatory;

and some of the synonyms given for drilled: practice, exercise, trained, preparation, instructed.

Now dictionary definitions: forced - constrained: lacking spontaneity; not natural; from Websters dictionary - 1 : compelled by force or necessity : involuntary, done or produced with effort, exertion, or pressure

drilled: from Websters dictionary - to fix something in the mind or habit pattern of by repetitive instruction, to train or exercise, to impart or communicate by repetition.

So looking at the synonyms and dictionary definitions the difference is clear: When you force discipline on someone it is done with exertion, pressure, something unnatural they probably would not otherwise do. t is something that is a strain to do.It's not voluntary, but mandatory.

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by wrdweaver on June 1st, 2009

Continued - When you drill discipline into someone, it is done with they do willingly, they train, receive instruction, it is something learned through repeating the process over and over. It is someone preparing for a given task. Working on something until it is afixed to the mind. It is voluntary, willingly learned.

Sorry explanation is lengthy, but did not know how else to explain. Hope this answers your question.

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by wrdweaver on June 1st, 2009

The explanation is literally ok but,to drill something,you need to exert force.Both processes are interrelated.Not everyone is agile enough to take on the hardship with ease.

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by engineer is Terminator on June 2nd, 2009

One last thing - maybe to drill takes force sometimes - but that would be if someone didn't want to do it or learn the discipline. Think about it, the men and women in the military They Volunteered for this, willingly signed up knowing what was in store for them. And some of them, even after going through this rigorous discipline re-enlist. To me, there is no force behind that, it's done with ease because they elect to do it, it's volunteer.

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by wrdweaver on June 2nd, 2009

Not all do volunteer.Some take it as a source of getting the college fund and getting some insurance done.

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by engineer is Terminator on June 2nd, 2009

That's still volunteering, they weren't drafted, no one made the join. They chose to join, for whatever reason, they chose, full well knowing what was in store for them. Knowing the rigid discipline the military requires. Even if it was for college funds or to get insurance, their joining was still done voluntarily.

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by wrdweaver on June 2nd, 2009

And how about being kicked out in 3 months or so?

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by engineer is Terminator on June 2nd, 2009

My understanding, a person does not get kicked out of the military without a medical reason. Also the military services can kick a person if they fail to measure up to the Military standards. In most cases, the commander must show "rehabilitative measures" before they can impose an involuntary discharge, and that can mean Article 15 (loss of stripes, loss of pay, restrictions, extra duties, correctional custody -- i.e., "jail"), before the commander can take that final step. Some of the reasons are failing weight requirements, failing training, AWOL, and of course, misconduct. Failing weight requirements takes longer, they try to help the person lose weight through diet and exercise. Failing training can get one kicked out, or they might reclassify and reassign the person to a lesser job not requiring a lot of effort. AWOL and misconduct runs the risk of dishonorable discharge, but not every time. Even if not discharged, there is consequences to suffer for these actions.

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by wrdweaver on June 3rd, 2009

Thanks for all those information.I was talking of failure in training.Recently a guy I know was thrown out because of lack of interest in anything he was assigned to.He may be an exception but,his friends also followed his foot steps.It's a shear annoyance for his family but,he boasts of being in bootcamp once.
Now tell me.Is that the real temperament of a soldier?

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by engineer is Terminator on June 3rd, 2009

Thanks.

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by engineer is Terminator on May 30th, 2009

Agreed.Thanks

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by engineer is Terminator on June 27th, 2009

Agreed.Behaviour problems are really hard to deal with and when schools and colleges classify students as people with behaviour problem,they become more stubbon to stick to what they are.And the way they are counselled,it really sucks.Neither the college nor the teachers dealing with them have any interest to deal with them.They remain as they are.

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by engineer is Terminator on May 30th, 2009

Yeah,that's what I exactly meant.I have a friend who joined the boot camp when he was 18.He left the marines 2 months ago.He is terrible chap to deal with now a days and does all sort of things that he is not supposed to.Some of his friends who were also in the armed forces are just the same.

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by engineer is Terminator on May 30th, 2009

disciplined doesn't mean you follow all the rules. Just the ones your drill sergeant asks you to ;)

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by Anonymous on May 30th, 2009

Sure thing.

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by engineer is Terminator on May 30th, 2009

Awiting your come back, soldier.

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by engineer is Terminator on June 27th, 2009

I am BACK!

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by Anonymous on July 30th, 2009

Sooooooo Looooooooooong.Now what's that?

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by engineer is Terminator on July 30th, 2009