Is Israel a warmongering nation, or is it justified to have these disproportionate attacks on its neighbours?

Comments

• So, it's ok to shoot one way?

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  by scubabob on December 30th, 2008

• Whose country is it?

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  by --paw43--is back for now on December 30th, 2008

• It's both.

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  by scubabob on December 30th, 2008

• The palestinians were displaced to make way for the israelis

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  by --paw43--is back for now on December 30th, 2008

• Those of the Jewish faith were displaced many times by various factions and religious groups as well. Historically, you can go way back and see both sides have had a presence in the area. Go back 2,000 years. Who was there then? Does Herod ring a bell?

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  by scubabob on December 30th, 2008

• But does that make it right?

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  by --paw43--is back for now on December 30th, 2008

• So, does it make it right for the reverse either? You're saying that it's fine for the little guy to shoot at the better armed but not in the reverse. Sorry, but if someone is stupid enough to try that route before negotiaion, then they're stupid enough to accept the consequences. If Hama is a political entity there at the will of the Palestinian people and a true democratic movement, it would listen to it's people and stop firing katushas. That's what has started the entire mess again and stopped the peace process. Again and again. It's always Hamas starting this. Fatah figured out the best way to get a deal is to negotiate. Apparently it's working since the standard of living in the West Bank is substantially higher than in Gaza. Fewer people are dying as well. Win win.

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  by scubabob on December 30th, 2008

• Ask the lesser armed Irish how they overcame 800 yrs of Great British oppression!

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  by --paw43--is back for now on December 30th, 2008

• They didn't use katushas did they?

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  by scubabob on December 30th, 2008

• They used whatever was at their disposal. They fought a dirty fight when they had to!

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  by --paw43--is back for now on December 30th, 2008

• Right...and your point?

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  by scubabob on December 31st, 2008

• Think before answering that. Then revisit your answer again. Sound familiar from a different direction?

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  by scubabob on December 31st, 2008

• You asked a question I answered it!

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  by --paw43--is back for now on December 31st, 2008

• No, you used a convenient way to dodge the question. Did the Irish use terror in gaining their current status? I'll forwarn you. Using the IRA is NOT how it happened.

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  by scubabob on December 31st, 2008

• Yes they did!

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  by --paw43--is back for now on December 31st, 2008

• No...they didn't. Get it together.Paw...I'd stop there if I were you.

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  by scubabob on December 31st, 2008

• Ha ha.....both sides used terror in the war!

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  by --paw43--is back for now on January 1st, 2009

• Paw - You are correct. As much injustice as Jews have suffered in the past it does not give them the right to perpetrate injustice now. The Palestinians didn't have anything to do with the Nazi "final solution" nor the pogroms in Russia nor any anti0-semitic persecution in the US or anywhere else. But somehow they are expected to simply accept the loss of their land and political rights to pay for everyone else's debts.
  .
  If the west wanted to buy off Jews with a homeland they should have given them Bavaria or maybe Nebraska.

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  by 23Skidoo on January 5th, 2009

• agree with you 100% 23skidoo!

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  by --paw43--is back for now on January 5th, 2009

• Scubabob refers to Irelands recent history and not the struggle for freedom that has been Irelands cause way before the "Ulster" war!

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  by --paw43--is back for now on January 5th, 2009

• Or maybe given them Madagascar like the Germans wanted to do.+5

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  by Schonberg on August 31st, 2009

• Except that Madagascar would have also been in innocent victim in the deal.

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  by 23Skidoo on September 1st, 2009

• I think Dr Joseph Megele was in line for the Govenors job,but that was long before the final solution was adopted.

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  by Schonberg on September 1st, 2009

• That wasn't really my point. Rather let those who want to give actually pay the cost, i.e. the US and Germany and maybe Russia.

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  by 23Skidoo on September 1st, 2009

Comments

Comments

• I agree, i won't answer this question as i've already been in one fight today.

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  by Bigessfour wears a Army COAT on December 30th, 2008

• LOL. Bigessfour, you sound like me. I've made it my new year's resolution to avoid responding to certain people. I've decided it's just a waste of time with some. Take care!

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  by Lori K still ignores stalkers and trolls on December 30th, 2008

• It's all good, i am a big boy. I just want to have fun on AB not get into verbal sparring matches.

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  by Bigessfour wears a Army COAT on December 30th, 2008

• Exacly how I feel. I don't even entertain the 'I hate America' posers that respond just for the sake of being jerks. Done with that.

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  by Aksafari on December 30th, 2008

• yep, they probably are not even Americans. It's all good, they are entitled to their opinion, it's like butt holes, everyone has one.

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  by Bigessfour wears a Army COAT on December 30th, 2008

• Do you think the Palestinians should have just given up the land that they had lived on for the last couple 1000 years to make room a new country?

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  by 23Skidoo on January 5th, 2009

• unsubscribe, quick!

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  by Aksafari on January 5th, 2009

Comments

• Agreed

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  by 23Skidoo on January 5th, 2009

• you wanna support that opinion with some justification ?

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  by Sympho de Proggy on January 5th, 2009

• I will.
  It's a country that was created despite the fact that the land was already occupied by someones else - a group which subsequently lost their nation and political rights.
  Israel then launched aggressive wars of land acquisition.
  They have continuously supported policies of settling land that they have returned to the Palestinians.
  .
  Is that enough?

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  by 23Skidoo on January 5th, 2009

• it would have been,
  were it true...
  
  -the area wasn't forcefully taken by the israelis, it was given to them by the UN.
  -the are wasn't controlled by the palestinians, it was controlled by the turks, then brits.
  the palestinians had no governing body whatsoever, so the area wasn't occupied in any sense of the term.
  - israel didn't "launch" any wars.
  the wars were initiated by countries like syria, jordan, and egypt who tried to wipe israel out.
  when the IDF pushed them back, they gained territories which were later bargained away for peace.
  - in reference to your last point, no new settlements have been allowed to spring up in areas under the Fatah's sway, for example.
  jews who settle there settle without a land charter and are considered trespassers by israeli government.
  furthermore, in 2005 all israeli settlements neighboring Gaza were abandoned following israel's seperation from Gaza ( so I guess my point is: au contrair)
  .
  do you have any other points ?
  these don't make the cut

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  by Sympho de Proggy on January 5th, 2009

• I don't agree w/ TT, but the land was taken from the Palestinian inhabitants, regular farmers and peasants, sometimes by forcibly moving them off and sometimes not (when they left in the face of the threat of force because they figured they'd be back soon).

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  by Amorphous Blob on August 31st, 2009

• Sympho
  You bet - the land was invaded and then militarily occupied by foreign powers. Does that justify forcing another occupation on the residents?
  .
  The land was given to people who were mostly European, American and a smattering of others.
  .
  The area of Israel has expanded from the borders provided by the UN - and following wars the Israel fought.

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  by 23Skidoo on September 1st, 2009

• Although Israel did not start those wars except preemptively, and has only expanded to more defensible borders.

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  by Amorphous Blob on September 1st, 2009

• There "preemptively" is a mighty big "except" - especially to those on the other end. I don't completely disagree with you but let's call a spade a spade - and an aggressor an aggressor.

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  by 23Skidoo on September 1st, 2009

• In 1967 it was a true preemptive attack in the face of imminent coordinated attacks by Egypt et al. I can't really blame any nation for defending itself like that, although I know the whole situation there is a cluster.

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  by Amorphous Blob on September 1st, 2009

• I agree. Defense is fair game. But then, those countries probably saw it as defending against an unwelcome usurper rapidly becoming a local military threat.

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  by 23Skidoo on September 1st, 2009

• Sure, or at least a just war to take back their territory.

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  by Amorphous Blob on September 1st, 2009

Comments

• +6 :-)

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  by 23Skidoo on January 5th, 2009

• Upon my life already!!

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  by Schonberg on August 31st, 2009

• Such nice words...

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  by TomFluflu on November 16th, 2009

• Something my grandmother taught me.

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  by Schonberg on November 16th, 2009

Comments

• Why is it that people can't see that? Israel has usurped, invaded and oppresed the Palestinian people in their own country? Why is it that people think they don't have a right to fight back and defend themselves? Are you and I alone on this one?

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  by Rinky Dinky Do on January 5th, 2009

• No - but maybe shouted down.

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  by 23Skidoo on January 5th, 2009

• usurped invaded and oppressed... huh ?
  care to explain that ?
  .
  invaded ?
  wasn't the land give to the jews by the UN in the 40s ?
  .
  usurped ?
  before that the land was ruled by the Ottoman turks, which, needless to say, aren't palestinians, so the land wasn't actually THEIRS when the jews got it.
  .
  and oppressed ?
  they have their own political party, they have have elected officials in the israeli parliament, they are given every right other citizens have and are largely exempt from military service to spare them the "conflict of interest".
  .
  so, how exactly have they been wronged by israel ?

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  by Sympho de Proggy on January 5th, 2009

• If you truly wanted the answers to those questions, you would have found them on your own. Like hell if I'm gonna even attempt to convince a warmonger Fundie that they're wrong. That'll be like plowing in the ocean. Keep talking to yourself and have fun!

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  by Rinky Dinky Do on January 5th, 2009

• XD I come to you with facts, you whine platitudes and insults...
  don't you feel a little pathetic ?
  .
  PS
  fundie ?
  I'm an atheist, ass

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  by Sympho de Proggy on January 5th, 2009

• Just because you claim to be one doesn't mean you are. Look in your black, shriveled up heart and you'll find the truth in there...or not

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  by Rinky Dinky Do on August 6th, 2009

• religion, or lack of religion, has nothing to do with this discussion.
  you either can't or wont answer to any of the arguments i put forward...
  .
  and why didn't you ?
  if israel is such a tyrant, it should be pretty damn easy to demonstrate...
  so please, read my first comment here and disprove it.
  .
  how are the israelis an invader when the land was given to them by the UN ?
  .
  how are they usurpers when the land never belonged to the palestinians in the first place ?
  it belonged to the ottoman empire, and then became england's as spoils of war.
  no matter how far back you'd go inhistory you'll never find this land being own by "palestinians".
  .
  and finally, how have they been oppressed when they have a full citizenship complete with their own political parties ?
  also, palestinians enjoy religious freedom that sometimes even exceed the freedoms of jewish israelis (in marriage, for example).
  .
  you made claims.
  back them up.
  i'm waiting

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  by Sympho de Proggy on August 7th, 2009

• Sympho de Proggy Jan, 05 2009 at 01:35 PM
  usurped invaded and oppressed... huh ?
  care to explain that ?
  .
  invaded ?
  wasn't the land give to the jews by the UN in the 40s ?
  .usurped ?
  ----------------------------------------
  
  Palestine: formerly also Palestina is a conventional name used, among others, to describe a geographic region between the Mediterranean Sea and the Jordan River, and various adjoining lands.

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  by Rinky Dinky Do on August 7th, 2009

• As a geographical term in its broadest application, Palestine can refer to 'ancient Palestine,' an area that includes contemporary Israel and the Palestinian territories, as well as part of Jordan, and some of both Lebanon and Syria. In classical or contemporary terms, it can refer to the area within the boundaries of what was once British Mandate Palestine (1920-1948), an area which included the Transjordan until the establishment of the Kingdom of Jordan in 1922. The term Land of Israel is used to refer to the same geographic region, both narrowly or broadly defined, by Israelis, Jews and Christian Zionists, among others. Other terms for the same area include Canaan and the Holy Land.

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  by Rinky Dinky Do on August 7th, 2009

• The name "Palestine" is the cognate of an ancient word meaning "Philistines" or "Land of the Philistines". The earliest known mention is thought to be in Ancient Egyptian texts of the temple at Medinet Habu which record a people called the P-r-s-t (conventionally Peleset) among the Sea Peoples who invaded Egypt in Ramesses III's reign. The Hebrew name Peleshet (פלשת Pəléshseth), usually translated as Philistia in English, is used in the Bible to denote the southern coastal region that was inhabited by the Philistines to the west of the ancient Kingdom of Judah.

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  by Rinky Dinky Do on August 7th, 2009

• The Assyrian emperor Sargon II called the same region Palashtu or Pilistu in his Annals.[3][4][4][8] In the 5th century BCE, Herodotus wrote in Ancient Greek of a 'district of Syria, called Palaistinê" (whence Palaestina, whence Palestine). Moshe Sharon writes that from this point forward, Palaestina was commonly used to refer to the coastal region, and shortly thereafter, the whole of the area inland to the west of the Jordan River. The latter extension occurred when the Roman authorities, following the suppression of the Bar Kokhba rebellion in the 2nd century CE, renamed "Provincia Judea" (Iudaea Province; originally derived from the name "Judah") to "Syria Palaestina" (Syria Palaestina), in an attempt to erase the memory of and motivations for the Jewish revolt.

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  by Rinky Dinky Do on August 7th, 2009

• During the Byzantine period, the entire region (Syria Palestine, Samaria, and the Galilee) was named Palaestina, subdivided into Diocese I and II. The Byzantines also renamed an area of land including the Negev, Sinai, and the west coast of the Arabian Peninsula as Palaestina Salutoris, sometimes called Palaestina III.

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  by Rinky Dinky Do on August 7th, 2009

• The Arabic word for Palestine is Philistine (commonly transcribed in English as Filistin, Filastin, or Falastin). Moshe Sharon writes that when the Arabs took over Greater Syria in the 7th century, place names that were in use by the Byzantine administration before them, generally continued to be used. Hence, he traces the emergence of the Arabic form Filastin to this adoption, with Arabic inflection, of Roman and Hebrew (Semitic) names. Jacob Lassner and Selwyn Ilan Troen offer a different view, writing that Jund Filastin, the full name for the administrative province under the rule of the Arab caliphates, was traced by Muslim geographers back to the Philistines of the Bible.

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  by Rinky Dinky Do on August 7th, 2009

• The use of the name "Palestine" in English became more common after the European renaissance. The name was officially revived and used after the fall of the Ottoman Empire (1517-1917) and applied to the territory in this region that was placed under the British Mandate for Palestine.
  
  Some other terms that have been used to refer to all or part of this land include Canaan, Greater Israel, Greater Syria, the Holy Land, Iudaea Province, Judea, Israel, "Israel HaShlema", Kingdom of Israel, Kingdom of Jerusalem, Land of Israel (Eretz Yisrael or Ha'aretz), Levant, Retenu (Ancient Egyptian), Southern Syria, and Syria Palestina.

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  by Rinky Dinky Do on August 7th, 2009

• The boundaries of Palestine have varied throughout history. Prior to its being named Palestine, Ancient Egyptian texts (c. 14 century BCE) called the entire coastal area along the Mediterranean Sea between modern Egypt and Turkey R-t-n-u (conventionally Retjenu). Retjenu was subdivided into three regions and the southern region, Djahy, shared approximately the same boundaries as Canaan, or modern-day Israel and the Palestinian territories, though including also Syria.

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  by Rinky Dinky Do on August 7th, 2009

• Scholars disagree as to whether the archaeological evidence supports the biblical story of there having been a Kingdom of Israel of the United Monarchy that reigned from Jerusalem, as the archaeological evidence is both rare and disputed.[22][23] For those who do interpret the archaeological evidence positively in this regard, it is thought to have ruled some time during Iron Age I (1200 - 1000 BCE) over an area approximating modern-day Israel and the Palestinian territories, extending farther westward and northward to cover much (but not all) of the greater Land of Israel.

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  by Rinky Dinky Do on August 7th, 2009

• Philistia, the Philistine confederation, emerged circa 1185 BCE and was comprised of five city states: Gaza, Ashkelon, Ashdod on the coast and Ekron, and Gath inland. Its northern border was the Yarkon River, the southern border extending to Wadi Gaza, its western border the Mediterranean Sea, with no fixed border to the east.
  
  By 722 BCE, Philistia had been subsumed by the Assyrian Empire, with the Philistines becoming 'part and parcel of the local population,' prospering under Assyrian rule during the 7th century despite occasional rebellions against their overlords. In 604 BCE, when Assyrian troops commanded by the Babylonian empire carried off significant numbers of the population into slavery, the distinctly Philistine character of the coastal cities dwindled away, and the history of the Philistines as a distinct people effectively ended.

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  by Rinky Dinky Do on August 7th, 2009

• The boundaries of the area and the ethnic nature of the people referred to by Herodotus in the 5th century BCE as Palaestina vary according to context. Sometimes, he uses it to refer to the coast north of Mount Carmel. Elsewhere, distinguishing the Syrians in Palestine from the Phoenicians, he refers to their land as extending down all the coast from Phoenicia to Egypt. Josephus used the name Παλαιστινη only for the smaller coastal area, Philistia. Pliny, writing in Latin in the 1st century CE, describes a region of Syria that was "formerly called Palaestina" among the areas of the Eastern Mediterranean.

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  by Rinky Dinky Do on August 7th, 2009

• Since the Byzantine Period, the Byzantine borders of Palaestina (I and II, also known as Palaestina Prima, "First Palestine", and Palaestina Secunda, "Second Palestine"), have served as a name for the geographic area between the Jordan River and the Mediterranean Sea. Under Arab rule, Filastin (or Jund Filastin) was used administratively to refer to what was under the Byzantines Palaestina Secunda (comprising Judaea and Samaria), while Palaestina Prima (comprising the Galilee region) was renamed Urdunn ("Jordan" or Jund al-Urdunn).

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  by Rinky Dinky Do on August 7th, 2009

• Should I continue or is that enough?
  Also, please let me know if there is anything in there that you don't understand. I'll be happy to explain it to you

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  by Rinky Dinky Do on August 7th, 2009

• you've said, or quoted, much about the name of the area...
  nothing about the people.
  the name palestine comes from the philistine people.
  a people long gone, who came from europe to the middle east by sea.
  .
  they have nothing in common with palestinians.
  culturally , genetically, historically.
  nothing.
  they are NOT palestinians, not are they their ancestors.
  .
  all those who are referred to as palestinians nowadays come from arab states.
  their ancestors are from the arab nation, not the philisine.
  .
  the "palestinians", as the term is now used, haven't existed until 1948.
  when israel became a country, this group suddenly materialized out of nowhere, claiming it was theirs.
  .
  they have no historical right to make such a claim.
  their name is similar to a name that was once relevant because of a completely different people that have since faded into memory.
  but thorughout history, these people have always been arabs.
  NEVER "palestinians".
  .

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  by Sympho de Proggy on August 8th, 2009

• throughout history every conquering nation recorded the goings-on in this area.
  .
  not a one of them ever mentioned the palestinian people.
  the philistine people existed.
  but they came from europe, had fair skin and red hair.
  they have nothing to do with palestinians.
  .
  what the records do mentions is arabs living in the area.
  that's what they have always been.
  arabs.
  the term "palestinians" is political sleight.
  they chose a similar name to confuse themselves with the history of the area.
  .
  so that people will do like you have done.
  they'll look at the histories, see all these names which are similar to theirs, and say "good enough for me".
  .
  you know what ?
  i'll do you one better.
  even arab historians and scholars have no record of palestinians in the area.
  .
  what they do have a record of is "arabs who inhabit the land of israel".
  which is how the Quran describes the region.

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  by Sympho de Proggy on August 8th, 2009

• Sympho de Proggy Aug, 08 2009 at 04:18 AM
  not a one of them ever mentioned the palestinian people.
  the philistine people existed.
  but they came from europe, had fair skin and red hair.
  they have nothing to do with palestinians.
  
  ------------------
  
  The boundaries of Palestine have varied throughout history. Prior to its being named Palestine, Ancient Egyptian texts (c. 14 century BCE) called the entire coastal area along the Mediterranean Sea between modern Egypt and Turkey R-t-n-u (conventionally Retjenu). Retjenu was subdivided into three regions and the southern region, Djahy, shared approximately the same boundaries as Canaan, or modern-day Israel and the Palestinian territories, though including also Syria.

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  by Rinky Dinky Do on August 8th, 2009

• Philistia, the Philistine confederation, emerged circa 1185 BCE and was comprised of five city states: Gaza, Ashkelon, Ashdod on the coast and Ekron, and Gath inland. Its northern border was the Yarkon River, the southern border extending to Wadi Gaza, its western border the Mediterranean Sea, with no fixed border to the east.

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  by Rinky Dinky Do on August 8th, 2009

• By 722 BCE, Philistia had been subsumed by the Assyrian Empire, with the Philistines becoming 'part and parcel of the local population,' prospering under Assyrian rule during the 7th century despite occasional rebellions against their overlords. In 604 BCE, when Assyrian troops commanded by the Babylonian empire carried off significant numbers of the population into slavery, the distinctly Philistine character of the coastal cities dwindled away, and the history of the Philistines as a distinct people effectively ended.

  • Report
  

  by Rinky Dinky Do on August 8th, 2009

• The boundaries of the area and the ethnic nature of the people referred to by Herodotus in the 5th century BCE as Palaestina vary according to context. Sometimes, he uses it to refer to the coast north of Mount Carmel. Elsewhere, distinguishing the Syrians in Palestine from the Phoenicians, he refers to their land as extending down all the coast from Phoenicia to Egypt. Josephus used the name Παλαιστινη only for the smaller coastal area, Philistia. Pliny, writing in Latin in the 1st century CE, describes a region of Syria that was "formerly called Palaestina" among the areas of the Eastern Mediterranean.

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  by Rinky Dinky Do on August 8th, 2009

• Since the Byzantine Period, the Byzantine borders of Palaestina (I and II, also known as Palaestina Prima, "First Palestine", and Palaestina Secunda, "Second Palestine"), have served as a name for the geographic area between the Jordan River and the Mediterranean Sea. Under Arab rule, Filastin (or Jund Filastin) was used administratively to refer to what was under the Byzantines Palaestina Secunda (comprising Judaea and Samaria), while Palaestina Prima (comprising the Galilee region) was renamed Urdunn ("Jordan" or Jund al-Urdunn).

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  by Rinky Dinky Do on August 8th, 2009

• An archaeological textual reference concerning the territory of Palestine is thought to have been made in the Merneptah Stele, dated c. 1200 BCE, containing a recount of Egyptian king Merneptah's victories in the land of Canaan, mentioning place-names such as Gezer, Ashkelon and Yanoam, along with Israel, which is mentioned using a hieroglyphic determinative that indicates a nomad people, rather than a state.

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  by Rinky Dinky Do on August 8th, 2009

• The earliest human remains in Palestine were found in Ubeidiya, some 3 km south of the Sea of Galilee (Lake Tiberias), in the Jordan Rift Valley. The remains are dated to the Pleistocene, ca. 1.5 million years ago. It is traces of the earliest migration of Homo erectus out of Africa. The site yielded hand axes of the Acheulean type.
  Wadi El Amud between Safad and the Sea of Galilee was the site of the first prehistoric digging in Palestine, in 1925. The discovery of the Palestine Man in the Zuttiyeh Cave in Wadi Al-Amud near Safad in 1925 provided some clues to human development in the area.

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  by Rinky Dinky Do on August 8th, 2009

• By the early Bronze Age (3000–2200 BCE) independent Canaanite city-states situated in plains and coastal regions and surrounded by mud-brick defensive walls were established and most of these cities relied on nearby agricultural hamlets for their food needs.
  Archaeological finds from the early Canaanite era have been found at Tel Megiddo, Jericho, Tel al-Far'a (Gaza), Bisan, and Ai (Deir Dibwan/Ramallah District), Tel an Nasbe (al-Bireh) and Jib (Jerusalem).
  The Canaanite city-states held trade and diplomatic relations with Egypt and Syria. Parts of the Canaanite urban civilization were destroyed around 2300 BCE, though there is no consensus as to why. Incursions by nomads from the east of the Jordan River who settled in the hills followed soon thereafter.

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  by Rinky Dinky Do on August 8th, 2009

• In the Middle Bronze Age (2200–1500 BCE), Canaan was influenced by the surrounding civilizations of Egypt, Mesopotamia, Phoenicia, and Syria. Diverse commercial ties and an agriculturally based economy led to the development of new pottery forms, the cultivation of grapes, and the extensive use of bronze. Burial customs from this time seemed to be influenced by a belief in the afterlife

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  by Rinky Dinky Do on August 8th, 2009

• Developments in Palestine between 1250 and 900 BCE have been the focus of debate between those who accept the Old Testament version on the conquest of Canaan by the Israelite tribes, and those who reject it. Niels Peter Lemche, of the Copenhagen School of Biblical Studies, submits that the picture of ancient Israel "is contrary to any image of ancient Palestinian society that can be established on the basis of ancient sources from Palestine or referring to Palestine and that there is no way this image in the Bible can be reconciled with the historical past of the region

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  by Rinky Dinky Do on August 8th, 2009

• No doubt you're learning history from the The Zionist Organization's definition concerning the boundaries of Palestine in their statement to the Paris Peace Conference in 1919

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  by Rinky Dinky Do on August 8th, 2009

• Sympho de Proggy Aug, 08 2009 at 04:18 AM
  "the term "palestinians" is political sleight.
  they chose a similar name to confuse themselves with the history of the area."
  -------------------------------------
  ROFL! Gotta love the dishonesty and denial! People put their hands over their eyes so that they can scream that the sun doesn't exist.

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  by Rinky Dinky Do on August 8th, 2009

• and no doubt you're used to scaring off opposition by verbosity.
  .
  remains from the pleistocene epic, the migration of homo-erectus, an etymological study of the name of the region, a discussion on the borders, agriculture...
  .
  you just pasted random irrelevant facts...
  .
  did you even read this ?
  .
  how can you possibly think this has any connection to what we're discussing ?
  .
  maybe we're not on the same page.
  the issue is this:
  i claim those who are referred to as palestinians today, have never ruled here.
  i also think those who are now known as palestinians have never been referred to as palestinians before 1948, but one topic at a time...
  .
  now, without copying and pasting the entire content of wikipedia, show me at what point in history have the local arab population been the ruler.
  keep in mind that you can't go too far back because then even if you do find something, the jews also ruled here, so if anything you can only call, you can't raise...

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  by Sympho de Proggy on August 8th, 2009

• and please...
  stop with the irrelevant facts.
  it doesn't make you correct, just a chore.

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  by Sympho de Proggy on August 8th, 2009

• Sympho de Proggy Aug, 08 2009 at 11:49 AM
  and no doubt you're used to scaring off opposition by verbosity.
  
  ******No, but I'm quite used to showing them in their true ignorance with verbosity, sadly for you...
  -------------------
  Sympho de Proggy Aug, 08 2009 at 11:49 AM
  you just pasted random irrelevant facts...
  ********Unlike you?
  ---------------------------
  
  Sympho de Proggy Aug, 08 2009 at 11:49 AM
  and please...
  stop with the irrelevant facts.
  it doesn't make you correct, just a chore.
  
  **********Inconvenient facts, eh?
  And I still love to see you produce something of value, rather than 2-word sentences. Classic Hasbara! Ha ha!

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  by Rinky Dinky Do on August 8th, 2009

• Sympho de Proggy Aug, 08 2009 at 11:49 AM
  i claim those who are referred to as palestinians today, have never ruled here.
  i also think those who are now known as palestinians have never been referred to as palestinians before 1948, but one topic at a time...
  ---------------
  Okay, great. And I claim that the Earth is flat. There! Are we now on the same page?

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  by Rinky Dinky Do on August 8th, 2009

• either you think that facts about the Pleistocene epic and the migration of homo erectus are relevant, and you're an idiot,
  or you're defending your scattering in every direction even though you know it's irrelevant, and you're a tool.
  .
  either way, we're not gonna accomplish anything here...

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  by Sympho de Proggy on August 8th, 2009

• Sympho de Proggy Aug, 08 2009 at 02:59 PM
  either you think that facts about the Pleistocene epic and the migration of homo erectus are relevant, and you're an idiot,
  or you're defending your scattering in every direction even though you know it's irrelevant, and you're a tool.
  ----------------------------------
  And this statement of wisdom coming from you

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  by Rinky Dinky Do on August 12th, 2009

• "either way, we're not gonna accomplish anything here..."
  --------------------------
  
  Agreed on that. You're employing all the classic Hasbara techniques from denial of facts to distraction and the proverbial ad hominem attacks. One of the techniques is bound to stick, eh?

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  by Rinky Dinky Do on August 12th, 2009

Comments

• You said it brother "There is no justification for indiscriminate killing of women and children! " So...when is Hamas going to come out from under the skirts of their women after firing their rockets designed to terrorize and let the rest of the world who hates terrorists take some serious head shots at them?
  I have some nice 223 plastic tips, very high velocity rounds that I'd like to introduce them to. Pulled off a 480 yard moving varmit last fall with a 40X scope. I'm sure I can hit a rodent like Hamas even further. Line 'em up. I'm game and I despise people that support their (Hamas) type of "war".

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  by scubabob on December 31st, 2008

• Hey...it would be fair too. Just like those katushas, my rounds are hand made with a few extra grains just to get the " Hiya...how was your day" feeling across. <insert whatever ticks you off the most here>. The kicker is...until this crap started, I was actually leaning towards sympathy for what Gaza was going through. Not now...they blew it again. Is that inherited stupidity? They go through cycles?

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  by scubabob on December 31st, 2008

• Scubabob, you said it, the world hates terrorists and so this is
  why we need to combat and defeat the Israeli forces. The tension is mounting against Israel and the European heat is on to bring them to justice. At last, I think I will see it served in my lifetime, a real treat!

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  by YoungBlood on September 18th, 2009

• You seem to have lost what a terrorist is. A terrorist creates terror and mayhem by wearing no uniform, fighting rules of their own making and not those of the Geneva Convention. You might want to look up that little agreement between states. Then use it as an argument that Israel is a terrorist state. You'll be hard pressed to do so.
  Personally...a real treat for me would be putting a little "love ya, best regards" scubabob munition into the head of anyone hiding behind a woman, child or religious institution. I guess that makes Hamas and Bin Laden's group a coin toss for honors of first gift. I'm also just a little ticked at groups that exploit women, children, religion and people that don't have an education, to further their own agenda in an armed "conflict" that the top dogs are fine with sending Little "Mustaffa" with a suicide belt into a crowd to kill...whoever happens to be there after filling his head with nonsense. And..in documented cases where the would be "Jihadist"

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  by scubabob on September 18th, 2009

• backed out and didn't press the switch...the top dogs detonated him by remote. Ain't life grand in Hamas?
  Before that last little mess, I actually had some sympathy for what was happening in Gaza. I've posted that before. Not any more. Not when I saw one Palestinian Self Governing Territory not sustain any damage or casualties simply because they were in dialogue with the Israelis. They were talking...not firing rockets from beside schools.That same group not taking casualties by Israeli defense forces are oddly enough...friends with Egypt. Hamas isn't. Arab brother hood in action? Or are they all one dysfunctional family? You tell me.

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  by scubabob on September 18th, 2009

• LOL. That is a lot of blah, blah which I am used to read LOL But I give you a point, the Israeli government in general aren't terrorists but war criminals, again you are right about that :)

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  by YoungBlood on September 18th, 2009

Comments

• I beleive it, Egypt isn't exactly buddies with Hamas. Hell, they shut their border with them a few times as well. Extremists in Gaza slipping into Egypt and conducting attacks there too.

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  by scubabob on December 30th, 2008

• Egypt has been at peace with Israel for decades.

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  by Factotum on August 31st, 2009

• Factotum, I believe Aksafari is pointing that out. That Egypt is assisting Israel against Hamas fighters who also happen to be attacking the odd Egyptian targets as well.

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  by scubabob on August 31st, 2009

Comments

• The same could be said for Israel,no?

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  by Ownster on December 30th, 2008

• As a retaliatory measure and for it's own protection.

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  by Worzel on December 30th, 2008

• How are countries like Palestine and Syria putting their people in jeopardy? If the west cared they would have intervened a long time ago.

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  by Ownster on December 30th, 2008

Comments

• Oh yes, DOWNRATE ME THEN, WILL YOU MOTHERFUCKER!:(

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  by Ownster on December 30th, 2008

• Join the club. I'll use my superior firepower to suppress that "anon" twit. :) Here's +6

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  by scubabob on December 31st, 2008

• Thanks scubabob.

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  by Ownster on December 31st, 2008

• NP. Sanity and reason ought to stick together. Usually I'm not in favour of some of the antics of the Israeli gov't but this time, hell yeah. If those rockets keep coming ( they have since this am) I'd totally be behind them if they went into Gaza and rained devastation on Hamas. The problem is, Hamas has this thing about hiding under skirts and behind kids. Unfortunately, that's what's going to stop this in it's tracks instead of it's natural conclusion. Hamas knows that. You can't kill them all. In this instance...I wish it was possible.

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  by scubabob on December 31st, 2008

• Im just glad that no Western countries have gotten involved yet, because there would be even more deaths. The company im in takes contracts in the middle east.

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  by Ownster on December 31st, 2008

• I hate to say it...but they gotta work it out themselves. If that means one way or the other and...it may be Gazans learning to swim. Only themselves to blame. What I find almost amusing is how Palestinians think that Egypt will back them. The Egyptians I met are a helluva lot smarter than that and look down their nose at this sh&t. They're over it all. They negotiated and got the Siani back. What is to figure out? Israel will negotiate for it's security. Same as with Jordan. Man...I gotta stop now. :)

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  by scubabob on December 31st, 2008

• Its fine, I like to have a discussion with someone who has more than one braincell.

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  by Ownster on December 31st, 2008

• No western country will get involved. The last time was the Suez crisis and...that didn't work out so well. :) It's a pit bull fight. Let top dog reign and loser gets mauled. Survial. Two guys with knives at each others throats and getting between them? Nuts. Either the UN deals with it or no one. The UN set up this confrontation. Moon isn't getting involved other than the token "calm down". Let 'em go at it. Get it over and done. Almost 60 years of tension, 38 years I had to listen to it ( credit of 7 years for growing up) and...yeah...get it over with.
  :)...lol...well I have two brain cells.

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  by scubabob on December 31st, 2008

• Really! Ihave two as well!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
  
  Seriously, some westerners do get involved. My 'company' is a contractor. We go into places like Gaza and Jerusalem to keep the peace.

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  by Ownster on December 31st, 2008

• A "contractor" in the modern sense of the word such as Blackwell?

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  by scubabob on December 31st, 2008

• Mercenary. Thats what I mean.

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  by Ownster on December 31st, 2008

• Blackwell corp aren't mercs? Lol...that's like saying Christ isn't christian. I kinda figured that's what you meant. Don't worry Merc..yer secret is safe with me. :)

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  by scubabob on December 31st, 2008

• It's not really a secret, I know loads of mercs who tell people their job.

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  by Ownster on December 31st, 2008

• and...contract work or not...it's still not a government involved. Therein lies the difference.
  Edit: No..you shouldn't if you do contract. If you still have the option, remove that comment.

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  by scubabob on December 31st, 2008

• I wont be touching the Israeli sector, thats a different division. I'll be in Iraq. Where everyone hates mercs.

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  by Ownster on December 31st, 2008

• Read what I posted

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  by scubabob on December 31st, 2008

• Not even somone actively serving posts any info that can identify family. Mercs especially so. I was former RCN and even that I learned right off the bat. How old are you? When I said, "Don't worry Merc..yer secret is safe with me. :)" that was...ok...you can stop there. I wouldn't broadcast involvement aywhere in the Arab world if I were you. Especially not in this question.

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  by scubabob on December 31st, 2008

• Im 29.

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  by Ownster on December 31st, 2008

• Hey..if you'd like to validate. Where who and why?

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  by scubabob on December 31st, 2008

• My cousin who's mountain rescue and did 3 tours in Basra may know you. He's OBE. Give a name. I can always ask that twat buddy of mine who thinks the 3rd is a smoker. 29? Young un. My family has been involved. Never mind.

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  by scubabob on December 31st, 2008

• Hey it's okay but I need to keep my name confidential, and the mountain operated in a different area. sorry.

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  by Ownster on January 1st, 2009

Comments

• yo - and they take other peoples' land and political rights and just don't give a damn! Rock on!

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  by 23Skidoo on January 5th, 2009

• Didn't say they were right or wrong in the bickering over land that's been going on for thousands of years. Someone bombed them and they blasted back, it's what most of us would have done yo...

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  by Ec-nal Licensed Bootie Inspector on January 5th, 2009

• OK.
  So you admire the Palestinians too, for the same reasons, then?
  yo

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  by 23Skidoo on January 6th, 2009

• I favor those who DON'T include suicide bomb attacks against civilians in their arsenal. So sue me yo...

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  by Ec-nal Licensed Bootie Inspector on January 6th, 2009

• Neither do I - but then rockets from gunships have much the same effect, no? yo?

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  by 23Skidoo on January 6th, 2009

• The rockets targets are bad guys, the suicide bombers targets are civilians (good guys). There's really nothing more to it ..yo...

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  by Ec-nal Licensed Bootie Inspector on January 6th, 2009

• Rockets may target alleged bad guys, but the number if civilian deaths show their indiscriminate side.
  And, well, dead and maimed bystanders are just as dead and maimed whether they got that way via an expensive US made electronic guidance system or a cheap Palestinian made meat based one. yeiii

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  by 23Skidoo on January 6th, 2009

• Whatever yo...

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  by Ec-nal Licensed Bootie Inspector on January 7th, 2009

• -5
  No arguments..
  yo

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  by 23Skidoo on January 7th, 2009

• WTF! +6

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  by Banned from Yahoo on June 23rd, 2009

• You believe down rating someone who disagrees is the joint. Too many good peeps here for that bitch.

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  by Ec-nal Licensed Bootie Inspector on August 15th, 2009

• Actually, no I don't. If I did I would have DR'd you right at the top, there. And If you'd had an argument to back up your opinion - even if I still disagreed - I would have UR'd.
  .
  I DR for lack of any argument.
  .

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  by 23Skidoo on August 16th, 2009

• He's only describing [accurately btw] Israel's history since 1947. No NEED for an argument.

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  by LarryH54 on September 18th, 2009

Comments

• Thanks for the link. Everyone should have a look at it.

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  by Adoomski luva on January 5th, 2009

• People around here aren't prone or predisposed to accepting facts. They only take at face value what their talking heads and governments tell them. The truth has nothing to do with it

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  by Rinky Dinky Do on August 6th, 2009

Comments

Comments

Comments

Comments

• Hitler is gone Dude, World War II is also over. But we still have our plates full here. A new regime to fight, a new group of nazis to defeat in the form of an israeli government.

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  by YoungBlood on September 18th, 2009

• Or you could stop using bullets and start using brains. Buy them out. Then you won't have ppl hating you for getting rid of them.

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  by LarryH54 on September 18th, 2009

Comments

• It looks like some "pro-Israel" lobby is gunning for the old dogs hide...whatever...I don't care...the truth will be told anyway.
  
  I like Israeli's as a people..my company does a few million bucks worth of business with them every year. My mother in law visited there and had a grand time...however, Israel has a big chip on it's shoulder that is only partially justified for being there, Israel is far too quick to use violence against it's neighbors and it's displaced refuges the Palestinians.
  
  Israel needs to be brought back into the community of nations - no longer can it be a "loose cannon" when it comes to international relations.
  
  That's the way I see it.

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  by Nightwatchdog on August 31st, 2009

Comments

• True that! +6

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  by LarryH54 on September 18th, 2009

Comments

• Now there's a racist comment if I ever heard one. Hmmmm, as to your fantastic insight into military matters ( I've served my country's Navy so I'm a little ahead of the game here when it comes to what you do in war), "disproportionate attacks" mean that the use of force has been carried out beyond the injuries sustained by the offended party and often are to include acts solely and knowingly against civilian targets as a means of reprisal sanctioned by a head of state.
  In a nutshell...if little Mustaffa is with his Dad, who just fired off a rocket...the onus of responsibility lies with Dad. If Mustaffa gets hurt..it's Dad's fault even if the opposing side knows Mustaffa is a non combatant but their strike is meant to "take Dad out" as a means to limit further casualties. Dad put him in the way of harm. It's sad...but so is war. Kids died in Great Britain and Germany over the same issue in ww2 during bombing raids.
  Your "extinction" premise has no merit either.

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  by scubabob on September 18th, 2009

• Do you know what a "buffer zone" is? If not, I'll explain. It's a method of defense that puts someone or something between you and an antagonist. Lebanon is actually a great example. As long as the Government of Lebanon keeps their border secure and free from anything arms wise but their own defense...that actually suits Israel just fine. Great even. Sort of like the arrangement we have here. We are a buffer zone between the Russians and Americans. As long as we keep our border free of Russians where they aren't supposed to be...the Americans are happy and vice versa with the Russians.
  And my last point. Waging war( in the proper sense of the word) is not about causing death primarily, nor "extinction". It's about defending your self and deterrent. You WANT to make it as miserable as possible for your opponent. Killing them doesn't work well. Maiming does.
  A dead man only needs 7 things. 6 pallbearers for 20 minutes and a dug grave.
  A maimed man needs care for life and consumes

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  by scubabob on September 18th, 2009

• enormous quantities of medical care, food and special items. There's also the psychological impact as well, not just to the maimed, but to those caring for him.
  It's a wonderful chain reaction all the way down the line. No...the Israelis... if they want to "extinct" the Arabs, well...that would not only not be in their best interests but so counter productive that it wouldn't even be a thought.
  They are fighting this conflict as a war. Hamas is fighting it like a bully in the sandbox. We all know what eventually happens to bullys.

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  by scubabob on September 18th, 2009

• LOL I'll skip the reading if you don't mind :)

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  by YoungBlood on September 18th, 2009

• DR's crack me up. LOL Unleash yourself on me for having my own ideas LOL I live in he US, I know having your own beliefs aren't allowed :) LMAO Viva American Communism
  -Unsuscribed-

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  by YoungBlood on September 18th, 2009

• That's typical. You don't read. Got that bomb strapped on already huh? I really don't care where you live. You do...what's your point?
  Young...the mere fact that you didn't even bother reading my rebuttal say volumes. You see...I read what you had to say and argued it. You don't bother and believe you're right by being ignorant as an excuse. An ignorant person can milk a cow if they're taught. A stupid person looks at the stool and tries to figure out if he can eat it. Are you stupid or just hungry for stool? If so..I could shit volumes..like Hamas is a loving, caring political institution that belongs in the UN and can be responsible for their people. You must like eating shit.

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  by scubabob on September 18th, 2009

• Want some sugar to get it down? Ohh..and the last bit. DR's? Not me, but if you'd like, I'll add one. Ya see, unlike a petty person such as yourself, that doesn't rebut arguments and just unsubs when they're beat, I'll be keeping watch here.

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  by scubabob on September 18th, 2009

• Your putting your pedal function into your mandible is what makes me happy. Yeah...google that.

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  by scubabob on September 18th, 2009

• LOL you are not getting to me ONE bit, YOU ACTUALLY AMUSE ME, you must be one of those trolls they are fighting against so much on this site and one hell of a miserable person LOL :) Let me guess you are a struggling comedian on the loop. Now don't get me wrong, I think you are funny and would really enjoy seeing the whole act. Where will you be standing next? 'Cause my wife and I would like to see it.
  PS: By the way when were you last in Israel and Gaza, my Israeli wife's asking? LOL
  I need to go check on my Porsche at the shop, they are turning my 1980 911 sc into a '73 RSR but I'll check back, so PLZ let us LOL know LOL

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  by YoungBlood on September 18th, 2009

• I see...I understand that you have no clue as to whats really happening. You aren't that bright are you? That's ok. When you grow up and understand what adults do when they can't get along, you'll see why you're so misguided.
  You have a wife? Goodness...and is she real or in your right hand? Or is she one of many wives?
  The "PLZ"... tell me what that is. Palestinian Loser Zone?.
  You morons just make me chuckle. And you wonder why I decided to back Israel after being on the fence so long. You....and people like you. You made an enemy by being an idiot.. How can you possibly expect anyone on the planet to respect you...when you act like idiots? You're morons. Racists morons. That's how this comment thread started...you being racist. You're moronic, racist idiots. You propagate ( big word I know) the entire thing, yet you claim innocence? Morons. Hey...thanks to you..I just had an epiphany ( another big word). Those that call themselves Palestinians in Gaza...are as moronic as yourself

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  by scubabob on September 18th, 2009

• Wow..you got nailed again. You're heading to the basement with that racist remark. Now I Dr you since you didn't change it and as it's racist or exclusive, I think I'll point it out to the moderators. Like a ball game and a call at home plate, we'll see.

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  by scubabob on September 18th, 2009

• Ohh yeah..I forgot to include that you in no way at all, rebutted my argument. Nada ( that's an American term isn't it?) Nothing is the English one. Go nuts. Rebut my argument. Hard to do when you already said you un sub'd...twice. I await, baited breath your third attempt at debate. It's gonna be as funny as your little car.

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  by scubabob on September 18th, 2009

• We run over them things. VW's have far more respect and we don't run over them. All to their own but I wouldn't drive one up here if I were you. Porche? Ok...have a good insurance agent. But I'm sure you already figured that out. You could move your racists butt here and not have your fellow citizen mark up your vehicle but you'd also have to not reveal your intentions as regards being a terrorist or supporting terrorist activity. Wow...the mere mention of that word terrorist has most likely got the NSA attention. I have no worries. None at all. Do you? HEY NSA>>>LOOKIE HERE>

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  by scubabob on September 18th, 2009

• Dude, LOL sorry but I am reporting this to AB, stalkers and trolls are prohibited on this site LOL
  By the way they attached the turbo flares just right on the 911 so I am kinda glad, it's a costly job all that you know LOL
  
  Besides dude I am no racist but have been a victim of it here in the US many times, probably by people like you. None of us in my families are from here other than my two young children. My 10 year old is reading your comments and shaking her head, can you believe it? And you are talking and mentioning about adult behaviors LOL It seems that you need to stop the booze or the drugs which ever and control yourself, they have anger management classes out there for people like you to attend to, you know that? LOL
  
  I hope you can get some sleep tonight LOL you seem all worked up with all these profanities thrown around. Maybe open another bottle or something LOL and relax. Put your head back, your feet up and close your eyes dude LOL Best Regards, Dude...:)

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  by YoungBlood on September 18th, 2009

• Dude..already reported. Your answer is enough to prove racism. Your Lol's..are enough for me. Your nonsense are just words in the wind and gone with sufficient knowledge. I have that, so do many that don't share you view of bull. You cannot rebut, you cannot argue, you can't win. And pulling the racist card doesn't help. Dude..you are so against yourself that helping you wouldn't help you. And that is sooo messed up.

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  by scubabob on September 18th, 2009

• Bud, you are losing yourself in your own anger! How can I be a racist Dude? You don't even know me! LOL My wife and I are self-employed and contribute to many charities, fund raisers for St Jude Hospital, The Children of Iran (Even though none of us are from there), local orphanage, Toys for Tots, the local Food Bank and many more through our own company LOL We were even in Ethiopia this year buying land to build a new school for children there and brought many things for them along with us LOL It was true refreshment unlike your comments and profanities towards my wife and I :) You are unreal dude and in need of getting a serious hold of yourself. You must be a 20 year old something, I can't give you more LOL Do you have your feet up yet? LOL

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  by YoungBlood on September 18th, 2009

• You're funny. You're still reported as a racist. Get over it. or jump the General Lee little boy. You make me chuckle, really. I had no idea that people like you existed until now. Is your make believe wife called Daisy as well? Wish her well for me in your fantasy land and hey... let's not forget your right hand. Good luck with that.

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  by scubabob on September 18th, 2009

• Dude, electronic conversations can be easy.How about you give me your info, I have plenty of money laying around to come and pay you a visit, I'm places all the time. Come to me darling!
  Also I hope you don't have a girlfriend, or wife, or kids because if you do I am sure they through plenty of physical and verbal abuse, your own mother I am sure goes thru it, shame on you dude.
  
  PS: I am hiring a janitor 10 PM to 6 Am if you need to! LOL :)

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  by YoungBlood on September 18th, 2009

Comments

• It depends how you see it! It ain't for me for example:)

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  by YoungBlood on September 18th, 2009

Comments

Comments

• -4? You only prove my point. You people are not rational.

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  by LarryH54 on September 18th, 2009