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by Liz on September 15th, 2008
Isaiah prophesised the coming of Muhammad in the book of Isaiah chapter XXI13-16. Kedar is Arabia, Tema is Medina and Dedan is Mecca. Compare this ols Arabian map with a modern one. Tema is in the exact place as Medina and Dedan is in the exact place as Mecca. Muhammad migrated Mecca from persecution where the people of Tema greeted and welcomed him
by borasalama on August 5th, 2008
His prophecies are in the NT. Here are some:
- “I will pray the Father, and he shall give you ANOTHER COMFORTER, that he may ABIDE WITH YOU FOR EVER” John 14:16
- "But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the SPIRIT OF TRUTH, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall TESTIFY OF ME" John 15:26
- “It is expedient for you THAT I GO AWAY: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.” John 16:7
- "I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now. Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, HE WILL GUIDE YOU into ALL TRUTH: for he shall NOT SPEAK OF HIMSELF; but WHATSOEVER HE SHALL HEAR, THAT SHALL HE SPEAK: and he will SHEW YOU THINGS TO COME. He shall GLORIFY ME" John 16:12-14
Here are some of the fulfilments of those prophecies:
> The ANOTHER COMFORTER implies someone with a similar mission to Jesus, a carrier of God’s message and a guide. “Muhammad is no more than a MESSENGER” (like Jesus was) HQ 3:144 and he’s told to say to people "If ye do love God, (then) FOLLOW ME” HQ 3:31
> HQ 33:40 says “(Mohammed is) the Seal of the Prophets” meaning there will be no more messengers and therefore no more scripture after him. This makes the HQ the Final Testament for mankind and one that will ABIDE WITH US FOR EVER
> The HQ TESTIFIES OF JESUS. HQ 4:171 calls him “Christ Jesus the son of Mary WAS a messenger of God” testifying that he had come in the flesh.
> It also GLORIFIES Jesus who is mentioned by name 500% times more than Mohammed, confirmed as the Messiah, a Word from God, conceived without any male intervention.
> Mohammed came over five centuries AFTER Jesus HAD GONE AWAY.
> The HQ is “a GUIDE to mankind” HQ 2:185
> The HQ “GUIDES TO THE TRUTH and to the Straight Path” HQ 46:30
>HQ 53:3 tells us that Mohammed did NOT SPEAK OF HIMSELF, it says “He does not say (aught) of (his own) Desire.”
> In HQ 10:15 Mohammed is told “Say: ‘It is not for me, of my own accord, to change it (the HQ): I follow nothing but what is revealed unto me: if I were to disobey my Lord, I should fear the penalty of a Great Day (to come)’" Aclear case of WHATSOEVER HE SHALL HEAR, THAT SHALL HE SPEAK
> The HQ predicted future events like HQ 30:2-4 “The Roman Empire has been defeated, In a land close by; but they, (even) after (this) defeat of theirs, will soon be victorious- Within a few years”. It mentioned facts which science has discovered only in the last few decades, for example HQ 4:56 says “as often as their skins are roasted through, We shall change them for fresh skins, that they may taste the penalty” alluding to pain receptors being only skin deep. The HQ also gives signs of the final hour HQ 101:4 “a day whereon men will be like moths scattered about, And the mountains will be like carded wool (blown away by the wind)” So the HQ did and does SHEW US THINGS TO COME.
> The prophecy in Deuteronomy 18:18 is analysed @ http://www.answerbag.com/a_view/3517713 which shows how the profile fits Mohammed,
After John 14:16 you leave out 17, it reads, "the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be in you."...It is clear he is not referring to Mohamed but to the Holy spirit.
by no_one_special on September 18th, 2008
Don't forget Jesus had to go away for the Comforter to come. “It is expedient for you THAT I GO AWAY: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you” John 16:7 The Holy Spirit did not have to wait for Jesus to go away before it could appear. Also notice Jesus is talking about a person a he not an it, in addition he uses the word ANOTHER, meaning another person like himself "ANOTHER COMFORTER, that HE may abide with you” John 14:16
by borasalama on September 18th, 2008
John 14:16-18 "And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Helper, to be with you forever, even the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees him nor knows him. You know him, for he dwells with you and will be in you." OK notice the last sentence Jesus is saying the spirit "dwells" with them in the present and will continue with them. This is not referring to Mohammad because Mohammad was not there with them. This is referring to Holy Spirit being poured out because Jesus would be the one pouring it. The Spirit is often spoken of as if it were a person. That is why there is a big mistake and people mistakenly say God is a Trinity. This is not a biblical teaching. God is only one not three.
by no_one_special on September 18th, 2008
noonespecial it is not me that's saying it, it's the scripture. It clearly has Jesus saying “It is EXPEDIENT for you THAT I GO AWAY: for IF I GO NOT AWAY, the Comforter WILL NOT COME unto you” John 16:7
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There is also all the other evidence in the above answer and also in the other answers I gave you links to. They are all from the scripture.
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If you want a more detailed reasoning you can examine the reasoning given in the transcript of a very old lecture @ http://islamworld.net/docs/Muhammad.in.Bible.html
by borasalama on September 18th, 2008
Borasalama I have gone to the links you provided, and I addressed them there. All of them if I am not mistaken... It is true that Jesus spoke of the holy spirit as a “helper” or "comforter" and spoke of such helper as ‘teaching,’ ‘bearing witness,’ ‘giving evidence,’ ‘guiding,’ ‘speaking,’ ‘hearing,’ and ‘receiving.’ In so doing, the original Greek shows Jesus at times applying the personal pronoun “he” to that “helper” (paraclete). (Compare Joh 14:16, 17, 26; 15:26; 16:7-15.) However, it is not unusual in the Scriptures for something that is not actually a person to be personalized or personified. Wisdom is personified in the book of Proverbs 1:20-33; 8:1-36
by no_one_special on September 18th, 2008
Wisdom is also personified at Matthew 11:19 and Luke 7:35, where it is depicted as having both “works” and “children.” The apostle Paul personalized sin and death and also undeserved kindness as “kings.” (Ro 5:14, 17, 21; 6:12) He speaks of sin as “receiving an inducement,” ‘working out covetousness,’ ‘seducing,’ and ‘killing.’ (Ro 7:8-11) Yet it is obvious that Paul did not mean that sin was actually a person.
by no_one_special on September 18th, 2008
So, likewise with John’s account of Jesus’ words regarding the holy spirit, his remarks must be taken in context. Jesus personalized the holy spirit when speaking of that spirit as a “helper” (which in Greek is the masculine substantive pa·ra′kle·tos). Properly, therefore, John presents Jesus’ words as referring to that “helper” aspect of the spirit with masculine personal pronouns. On the other hand, in the same context, when the Greek pneu′ma is used, John employs a neuter pronoun to refer to the holy spirit, pneu′ma itself being neuter. Hence, we have in John’s use of the masculine personal pronoun in association with pa·ra′kle·tos an example of conformity to grammatical rules, not an expression of doctrine.—Joh 14:16, 17; 16:7, 8.
by no_one_special on September 18th, 2008
TY noonespecial, a spirit in the non-physical sense might inspire but this spirit is metaphor for a prophet, a human, hence he has all those actions included in your list like hearing and speaking. And don't forget the word "another" in Christ's prophecy it rules out The Holy Spirit - unless you're suggesting there was more than one.
by borasalama on September 19th, 2008
John 14:26 tells us how the helper or counselor is,"But the Counselor, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you." So the helper is identified for us. What is recorded in John chapters 14 through 16 about the pa·ra′kle·tos (Paraclete, Comforter or helper) harmonizes with what the rest of the Bible says about the holy spirit. God through Jesus Christ used the holy spirit to help Christians in the first century C.E. By means of it as a “helper” they gained increased understanding of God’s purposes and prophetic Word. (Acts 2:33; 1 Cor. 2:10-16; Heb. 9:8-10) Men miraculously aided by the spirit spoke in foreign languages, explained God’s will and prophesied. (John 14:26; Acts 2:4; 21:4, 11; 1 Cor. 12:4-11; 14:1-4, 26) Thus, even though it is not a person, the holy spirit was used by God to help the Christians, to teach, to guide and to upbuild them.
by no_one_special on September 24th, 2008
The answer explains everything very simply. However, if anything is not clear and you want it explained you can raise that. It's upto you to accept or reject. But don't forget that:
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Jesus said "another", but what YOU are referring to is not "another" but the same (as I said unless you're declaring more than one Holy Spirit)
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Jesus did not have to go away for the Holy Spirit to come. It had already been around. Jesus clearly said “It is expedient for you THAT I GO AWAY: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you” John 16:7.
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We are talking about a person that will speak not a spirit that will inspire
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Jesus said "I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now" Mohammed brought many new things, however some people can still not bear them, even now.
by borasalama on September 24th, 2008
Not that I believe this but just out of curiosity, tell me, what if this helper was Paul? He was not one of the 12 so he could be the "other helper" he did come after Jesus death. What do you say to this borasalama?
by no_one_special on September 24th, 2008
Also just to make a point, in John 14:16,17 it reads, "I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may be with you forever; that is the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it does not see Him or know Him, but you know Him because He abides with you and will be in you." Do you see that Jesus words when taken out of context may seem that "another" implies a separate person. However, when taken into context the very next verse, Jesus clarify's that it is the spirit that is with them already. So this cannot be Mohammed since he was not around at the time. But that is a seperate issue. We can go either with my comment before this comment or if you would like we can take John 14:16,17 and discuss it. But it is clear that "another" was already with them. Confusion in wording arises at times due to the difference in expressions due to the languages in question. Sometimes we think that it is odd in the way the bible is written.
by no_one_special on September 24th, 2008
That is why it is wise to use the entire bible and intent of the language in question, also the context. It is not to difficult but at times it may be confusing, so we use the inspired word of God to determine the correctness of our reasoning, not just focusing on one or two particular scriptures and make an entire case. We have the whole bible, why not use the whole bible? We cannot pick and choose, can we? Of course not.
by no_one_special on September 24th, 2008
You say "Not that I believe this" regarding the prophecy being Paul and I'm inclined to agree with you there so we can lay that to rest.
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Don't forget Jesus emphasised his going away as a precondition for the helper to come. "It is EXPEDIENT for you THAT I GO AWAY: for IF I GO NOT AWAY, the Comforter WILL NOT COME unto you; but IF I DEPART, I WILL SEND him unto you. And WHEN HE IS COME..."
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However, I go along with the overall message of most of your remaining comments. I go along with the main teachings of Jesus, the understanding of the Jews who had the Hebrew scriptures for long before Jesus appeared on the scene, the understanding and practice of the early Christians, bearing in mind the fact that the choice of what would constitute the NT was made by a collection of people centuries after Jesus. All those are factors to take into account, together with the maximum amount of rational thinking.
by borasalama on September 25th, 2008
Paul fits much better with the Prophet you speak of. Why do you dodge it? Do not be afraid of entertaining the thought. In fact it is your reasoning that led me to pose that question two you. Let us use your reasoning.
by no_one_special on September 25th, 2008
OH wait you said, "Don't forget Jesus emphasized his going away as a precondition for the helper to come. "It is EXPEDIENT for you THAT I GO AWAY: for IF I GO NOT AWAY, the Comforter WILL NOT COME unto you; but IF I DEPART, I WILL SEND him unto you. And WHEN HE IS COME" but you conveniently leave out the very next verse in John 14:17 and it reads, "that is the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it does not see Him or know Him, BUT YOU KNOW Him BECAUSE He ABIDES WITH YOU and WILL BE IN YOU."... Get it? It abides already with them so it does not refer to Mohamed due to the fact Mohamed came much later. And Paul was at least alive during the time of the Apostles so he fits your reasoning much better.
by no_one_special on September 25th, 2008
Well they are all quoted sayings of Jesus, and you reckon they point to Paul. I suggest it's Mohammed and have outlined in detail both in the above answer and elsewhere how and why it is Mohammed. So I guess we have come to the end of the line on this one.
by borasalama on September 26th, 2008
Still you conveniently leave out the very next verse in John 14:17 and it reads, "that is the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it does not see Him or know Him, BUT YOU KNOW Him BECAUSE He ABIDES WITH YOU and WILL BE IN YOU."... Get it? It abides already with them so it does not refer to Mohamed due to the fact Mohamed came much later. Why are you side stepping that verse?
Also I do not reckon it points to Paul. Only that if we follow your logic by disregarding Peters statement, then the only logical one to fit that criteria is Paul, since he was an Apostle and was accepted as such and he came after Christ's death. But you rather side step the issue. Go ahead, the evidence speaks for itself.
by no_one_special on September 26th, 2008
This is an interesting debate. As always, I'm inclined to agree with Bora, I have an interesting point I'd like to make that I would like you guys to look into. In one of my religious philosophies classes, we were looking into the history of religious debate and argument. The point was made that, aside from total disbelief, no one argued about the specifics of religion until industrial revolution when science became a more understood social norm. Until machinery and science were in everyones jobs and homes, no one cared about the differences as specific in the bible as what you guys are debating. It wasn't a matter of specific wording because it was taught on principle and we can all agree that the principle nature of Jesus PBUH was perfect. Here's the kicker though, now that people look at it under scrutiny, there are debates like this one possible in the Bible. There are none in the Qur'an. There are no wording issues or contradictions and the Qur'an was revealed before the
by Spengo on September 26th, 2008
industrial revolution. Not to mention it wasn't bastardized by King James and had books removed or been edited to make it easier for the illiterate peasants to follow. Have you read any of the removed books? Interesting reads, one of the more interesting, I think it's in the book of Thomas where Jesus is quoted saying "God resides inside each of us". Just some interesting food for thought...I'm not trying to fuel the debate or stifle it...but I thought this argument is right on key for what we were talking about in class :)
by Spengo on September 26th, 2008
Incorrect Spengo. Jesus was repeatedly challenged on his beliefs. The Pharisee and Sadducee constantly questioned him. They took a position and Jesus had another.
by no_one_special on September 26th, 2008
And the fact that debates are more prominent now is irrelevant. All that is happening is we have the internet to connect differing minds. Before one lived in the community of his already existing religious beliefs and or ethnicity, technology simply changed that. It does not mean we agreed before, we just never encountered each other on a regular basis where theological beliefs were shared. It was basically they believe this and we that and that was that. Not the case anymore.
by no_one_special on September 26th, 2008
Borasalama what Spengo has introduce is irrelevant to our discussion. Do not side step my comment please. I am willing to discuss Spengo's comment but let us address our issues first.
by no_one_special on September 26th, 2008
I know it's irrelevant, I said that right off the start that it was just food for thought. You missed the point of my statement though. I wasn't saying Jesus wasn't questioned...I was saying that in the 17th century before the industrial revolution and science proving that things MUST be a certain way or they are false, the bible was taught more liberally as a guideline and not a book of scientific fact. Example...It took 7 days to create the earth, we measure a day in regards to the sun, the sun was created on the 2nd day "created light and dark". So how long was the first day if there were no "days" yet. You will now say that a "day" isn't 24 hours so some things in the bible are literal, some are metaphoric...but where is your magic key that tells us which is which? If you don't preach the bible as litarlly correct, it is a great moral story that teaches wonderful values and gets us close to God. If you teach it to be scientifically accurate or you compare it to
by Spengo on September 26th, 2008
any form of scientific fact, you start to get into debates like this one with arguments over capital letters and He/he arguments like you guys are having.
by Spengo on September 26th, 2008
I did understand you point and I addressed it read my comment at Sep, 26 2008 at 02:08 PM. I just did not want Borasalama to see this as an opportunity to dodge the question. If you read some of our exchange you see he is trying to dodge questions. Secondly the Hebrew word for day has a broad application, so it is not to be taken literal in this instance. Context must be taken into account and use of language.
by no_one_special on September 26th, 2008
right...literal or metaphoric...I understand what you are saying and that supports my statement. I don't think you can say with 100% certainty that a book that claims the universe made in days that weren't yet measured is specifically accurate on wording. I love the bible and have read it, I follow as much as I can...but I still find a lot of err in the way it was written for what to take literally and what to take metaphorically
by Spengo on September 26th, 2008
Contest helps with that part. It is not too difficult. That is not to say that I understand the deep things of God. But the bible was made for us to understand.
by no_one_special on September 26th, 2008
If it's so easy to understand, why is there all this debate?
by Spengo on September 27th, 2008
If it's been so easy to understand, why the numerous versions of the Bible that have sprung up, which one is Go's word or closest to it, why the RC's the Eastern Orthodox, the Protestants, including the JW's the Mormons and the thousands of different sects each claiming to have THE correct understanding? You claim Jesus is not God and there is no Trinity in Christianity, and you can argue that from...The Bible. The majority firmly believe you to be wrong....and they can argue there belief is firmly based on ....The Bible. Those are not exactly minor differences, are they? We are having the same problem between you and I because we are each trying to argue our case from ....The Bible. Amazing book...The Bible.
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Brings to mind II Corinthians 9:19-22 where although Paul is describing himself it uncannily applies to The Bible as well
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"For though I be free from all men, yet have I made myself servant unto all, that I might gain the more. And unto the Jews I became as a Jew, that I might gain the Jews; to them that are under the law, as under the law, that I might gain them that are under the law; To them that are without law, as without law, (being not without law to God, but under the law to Christ,) that I might gain them that are without law. To the weak became I as weak, that I might gain the weak: I am made all things to all men, that I might by all means save some."
by borasalama on September 27th, 2008
Arguing that there beliefs in Trinity are from the bible and showing it are two different things. If you look at other discussion I have has with Trinitarians on here you will see how quickly they run away from the evidence. They believe if they get angry and use one scripture or two they win. But there lack of addressing the points and there silence is even more convincing. Now borasalama, my comment at Sep, 26 2008 at 07:37 AM please address it, do not be like Trinitarians and dodge it.
by no_one_special on September 28th, 2008
Your refusal to accept my explanation cannot be regarded as a dodging by me. I have already addressed your point. What exactly is meant by the passage you have quoted is not very clear. It makes Jesus appear to be contradicting himself. Because of that I did not take it on board.
by borasalama on September 28th, 2008
Also I do not reckon it points to Paul. Only that if we follow your logic by disregarding Peters statement, then the only logical one to fit that criteria is Paul, since he was an Apostle and was accepted as such and he came after Christ's death. But you rather side step the issue. Go ahead, the evidence speaks for itself... That part of my comment i was in reference the second part of Sep, 26 2008 at 07:37 AM to. Do not dodge this.
by no_one_special on September 28th, 2008
I think we are in danger of pointlessly exhausting ourselves here. I will have a last go at responding. But before I do that I will outline the point I think you want me to respond to. According to you Deut. 18:18 is pointing to Jesus. You base that on what Peter is reported to have said. Now your question is why don't I accept that? Did I get that right?
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The reason why I don't accept that is explained in detail in my answer @ http://www.answerbag.com/a_view/3517713 The analysis there shows clearly how that particular prophecy fits Mohammed and not Jesus. If Peter had produced a better analysis that showed how that prophecy applied to Jesus only and nobody else, then I'd be the first to reject the analysis I posted in my answer.
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Now I haven't said anything really new in my last paragraph, but I hope you've got a better understanding of my position and we can break out of this circle.
by borasalama on September 29th, 2008
You believe your analysis overrides Peter's words under inspiration. Unless you think he did not speak under inspiration. You analysis is of trivial things like being married. Peter's came form holy spirit, unless you deny that again. This is not that difficult and it is funny to see your argument start to degrade into this. You want to break this circle just admit you do not hold the bible as credible. You do not have to admit it outright since you already many times more than implied it. But hey you can play the word game if you want.
by no_one_special on September 29th, 2008
noone...in all your threads you are so arrogant to assume you understand what people mean and say. You say Bora is implying the bible is not credible...he is saying quite the opposite though...He is saying that, according to the bible, the Qur'an is correct. And that works vice-versa as well. He is quoting scripture in argument, thus supporting his belief in the scripture he is quoting. Don't assume you know what people mean because you are trying to get an answer from them you won't get.
by Spengo on September 29th, 2008
You are the one who admitted that Muslims do not hold the bible as credible. Remember? In another thread I forget, maybe even this one. And truly forgive me as I do not want to sound arrogant, it is just this is stupid how borasalama is dodging my questions and playing a word game. I have answered his why can he not answer mine?
by no_one_special on September 29th, 2008
TY Spengo. I think noonespecial is blinding himself too much with faith, so much so he can't see
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that I am NOT dismissing the Bible as the work of devils or a book that's not even worth a mention (some Christians might view the HQ in those terms) Quite the opposite, I am regarding the Bible as a source that is good enough for one to look in and study for evidence.
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that I'm respecting his disbelief in the HQ and not using that as evidence.
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that my demonstration of how the prophecy in Deut 18:18 fits Mohammed and not Jesus depends on more than just the fact that both Moses and Mohammed were married and Jesus was not.
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that I have NOT shut the door on Peter, or anyone else who can produce a better demonstration of how the prophecy in Deut 18:18 fits Jesus or anyone else other than Mohammed.
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that I am actually defending Peter in a way by making an excuse for his statement, by saying we have to bear in mind that Mohammed came centuries after Peter.
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I'm not sure what else he's after, what else can I say?
by borasalama on September 29th, 2008
I actually commend you for not using the Koran as evidence. I must admit you have been good about that. However the fact remains you have not addressed my question at Sep, 28 2008 at 09:15 PM. As for respecting my disbelief in the Koran, borasalama I would gladly respect your disbelief in the bible as evidence if you would just come out and say you do not hold it as credible. I am honest with you, I do not hold the Koran as credible, why can you not just do the same? You demonstration of Moses and Mohammad is not a scriptural one but a comparison of your own. Is it even in the Koran? I will at least understand why you believe it, if it is the Koran. And as for you not shutting the door on Peter, BORASALAMA THE QUESTION ON Sep, 28 2008 at 09:15 PM. IS PRECISELY THAT. Paul fits that description better if we disregard Peters statement at Acts 3:19-26 as the other helper. Why??
by no_one_special on September 29th, 2008
Here is why...John 14:17 and it reads, "that is the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it does not see Him or know Him, BUT YOU KNOW Him BECAUSE He ABIDES WITH YOU and WILL BE IN YOU."... Get it? It abides already with them so it does not refer to Mohamed due to the fact Mohamed came much later. And Paul was at least alive during the time of the Apostles so he fits your reasoning much better.
by no_one_special on September 29th, 2008
Wait...I don't want to sound dumb here..but my casual observation of that statement is very simple, the final statement "WILL BE IN YOU", that sounds prophetic to the future. Stating I will mow the lawn. I will pay my bills. It will happen...says it hasn't yet.
by Spengo on September 30th, 2008
I think one of our problems which I have hinted at before is that I guess for you all reality outside the scripture has to be viewed in light of certain text of your scriptures. So if your scripture had said there will not be any answerbag anyone proving the existence of answerbag will be proving to you the work of the devil. For me scripture including the HQ HAS TO BE compatible with the reality outside the scripture. So if a part of the HQ had said there will not be any answerbag I'd be questioning my understanding or that part of the HQ.
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A Muslim accepts the HQ and, regarding all the scriptures that came before it, he will accept all that is in agreement with the HQ and reject only what goes against the teachings of the HQ.
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OK let's examine your claim then:
How can the world "does not see Him" refer to Paul? The world around him could surely see Paul, he was not a spirit.
How can the world does not "know Him" refer to Paul? At least those around him must have known Paul
How can Jesus say to the disciples "YOU KNOW Him (Paul)" and not ‘you WILL know him’?
How can Jesus say to the disciples " He (Paul) ABIDES WITH YOU" and not ‘he WILL abide with you’?
How can Jesus say to the disciples he “WILL BE IN YOU" if he meant Paul and not a spirit.
by borasalama on September 30th, 2008
1. You purposely leave out
"BUT YOU KNOW Him BECAUSE He ABIDES WITH YOU" Also Mohamed was not a spirit so by your reasoning it cannot apply to him either.
2. Again you leave out "that is the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it does not see Him or know Him, BUT YOU KNOW Him BECAUSE He ABIDES WITH YOU....This goes together that is why it is not making sense to you.
3. How can Jesus say to the disciples "YOU KNOW Him (Paul)" and not ‘you WILL know him’?" OK apply that to Mohammad.
4. "How can Jesus say to the disciples he “WILL BE IN YOU" if he meant Paul and not a spirit."... Yes borasalam, thank you. That is my point. See how it also cannot apply to Mohammad either?
by no_one_special on September 30th, 2008
whoa, whoa, I didn't use these verses to support the possibility of the prophecy being Mohammed, so you can't turn around to me and say 'well, it cannot apply to Mohammed either" of course they cannot apply to Mohammed, that's why I didn't use them.
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You used them to support your claim that they refer to Paul, and I was just pointing out to you how that is not likely.
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Those verses seem to be out of place. Placed where they are they appear to make Jesus contradict himself. I wasn't sure what they meant and I left them.
by borasalama on September 30th, 2008
Excuse me? I quote, Aug 5, 2008 at 9:32 pm "> The ANOTHER COMFORTER implies someone with a similar mission to Jesus, a carrier of God’s message and a guide. “Muhammad is no more than a MESSENGER” (like Jesus was) HQ 3:144 and he’s told to say to people "If ye do love God, (then) FOLLOW ME” HQ 3:31..Look at your comment at, Sep, 18 2008 at 05:42 PM and Sep, 24 2008 at 07:18 PM the latter part of that comment. And I suggested Paul fit that better than Mohammad because you reject Peter's statement at Acts 3:19-26. Using your logic I provided an alternative that better suites your reasoning.
by no_one_special on September 30th, 2008
this has been a long thread, each one of us having responded to the other's comments. My responses may not satisfy you nor yours satisfy me, but those have been our responses to each other. This has become a very long thread and I wish yo end it here. TY
by borasalama on October 1st, 2008
There may be a little confusion but it isn't anything we can't fix. Please let us continue. Borasalama I am sorry perhaps I have upset you but it is not reason to end this thread. We are discussing how Paul fits your logic better than Mohamed.
by no_one_special on October 1st, 2008
ok I am ready to please, so can you list, in bullet points, "how Paul fits your logic better than Mohamed"
by borasalama on October 2nd, 2008
Let us start one or two points at a time so that there is some order. I will start with one.
1. Jesus and Paul performed miracles. Mohamed did not.
by no_one_special on October 2nd, 2008
erm, which prophecy are we testing here? If it's the one in Deut 18:18 then the "like unto thee" refers to Moses and it follows that the profile we should be trying to match is that of Moses, not Jesus.
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Also it might help if you list all the main points of the complete profile in one go. No need to list more than, say, seven most important profile points.
by borasalama on October 2nd, 2008
Oops sorry I meant Moses and Paul.
1. Moses and Paul performed miracles.
2. Both believed in the promised seed that would crush the serpent.
3. Both were brethren or brothers.
by no_one_special on October 2nd, 2008
Well you had me confused for a bit.
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1 regarding miracles, there are reports that associate Mohammed with miracles, but it is universally agreed that the greatest miracle associated with Mohammed is the HQ. It is a unique book with its own style, a text that has remained unchanged for foourteen hundred years, it is widely read throughout the world, it is the most widely memorised text, a scripture without any versions, without any part contradicting another or inconsistent with the real world, a book that mentions scientific facts that were only discovered in recent decades.
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2 I don't know what Moses would have made of the phrase "seed that would crush the serpent" but if you replace the phrase with "Messiah" then yes so did Mohammed. The HQ confirms Jesus as the Christ, the Messiah.
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3 Deut 18:18 is asking us to look for the promised prophet NOT "from among THEM" (the Israelites) but "from among THEIR BRETHREN" = the bretheren of the Israelites = the Ishmaelites
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We've listed more than more than 13 similarities between Moses and Mohammed @ http://www.answerbag.com/a_view/3517713
by borasalama on October 3rd, 2008
1. There may be reports that he performed miracles but they are not from the Koran. And the Koran does not qualify as a miracle since it was spoken to Mohammad by the Angel Gabriel.
2. I am glad you see that the Genesis account refers to the Messiah. See that the "Seed" would crush the Serpent. So how would the Messiah do this? You see there is more to the story?
3. Do you not agree that Brethren means brothers? There were 12 tribes numbering into the thousands and totaling millions at some points. I see your reasoning, however, the Ishmaelites are descendants of Abraham by Sarah's maid servant, thus Ismael was a step or half brother. The word brethren can apply to both Israelite and Ishamelites so it can go either way. The problem is you attribute it "ONLY" to the Ishamelties. It can be applied to either. I saw your link on the similarities however you dismiss what Peter said at Acts 3:19-26 were he tells us who the prophet was. Also we are comparing Moses to Paul remember?
by no_one_special on October 3rd, 2008
1 Your first sentence is a fair point. I think in your second sentence you mean "the Koran does not qualify as a miracle OF MOHAMMED", if so, that's also, in a way, a fair point. But don't forget when the prophets were "performing" miracles they were not claiming THEY had the powers, like magicians do. The miracles were signs that these people were special, they were connected to a power beyond the capacity of man. In fact Jesus makes it clear, in Luke 11:20, that it is "WITH THE FINGER OF GOD" that he casts out devils. In John 5:30 he makes the all-embracing declaration “I can of mine own self do nothing”. The fact that the miraculous HQ came to Mohammed was a sign that he was special.
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2 I'm afraid you're trying to put words in my mouth. You were supposed to be listing ways in which Paul WAS like Moses but Mohammed WAS NOT. My point is simple - IF you're saying Moses and Paul believed that a Messiah was to come then so did Mohammed.
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cont..
by borasalama on October 4th, 2008
3 Let’s say after my first wife Susan I married again and had children from my second wife Helen as well. From abroad I ask my agent to gather my children from Susan and say to them that the management of the farm I leave to the best FROM AMONG THEM while the management of the factory I leave to the best FROM AMONG THEIR BROTHERS. Now I ask, does the management of the factory go to my children from Susan, or to their children? No, neither. Language and reason are telling us it goes to my children from Helen. If you still don’t accept we’ll agree to differ on it and leave it at that.
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4 you say the prophecy in Deut 18:18 applies to Paul and you listed THREE ways in which Paul was like unto Moses. I suggest the prophecy applies to Mohammed and listed MORE THAN THIRTEEN ways in which Mohammed was like unto Moses.
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I don't think there's much more to say on this thread, so this might be the right point to end it at.
by borasalama on October 4th, 2008
1. Yes that was my point Whether Mohamed is special or not is a different case. But him receiving the Koran is not a miracle "of" or "by" Mohammad. The difference is an Angel can speak to someone and may be considered a miracle but that would not make it "by" or "of" the one whom it happened to.
2. It is a similarity between Moses and Paul, their beliefs. Their beliefs on what the Messiah would accomplish.
3. You did not word it as the biblical account words it though. It wold be something like this, "If I gathered my wife Susan and the children we had together and said from among your BROTHERS" See the difference? They are all brothers.
4. It is not the number that counts. Also I listed three so that we could discuss it with some order, even you agreed that no more then seven was necessary. I can list several more but you already want to end the thread. Can you imagine if I listed more that 20? You would say it is too much to discuss. Oh and by the way I listed four reasons.
by no_one_special on October 6th, 2008
1 You mention the first part of point 1 where I am agreeing with you but you forgot to mention the second part where I show that the same argument applies to the other miracles - those performing them are not the authors of the miracles, they've just been given those miracles.
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2 So where did Moses express beliefs about Jesus which were also expressed by Paul?
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3 no, I don't see. I must be missing something here. Was not Moses the leader of the Israelites?
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4 I think I've pointed out substantial similarities between the two men and am happy to end point 4 right here.
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If you can shed light on points 2 and 3 I'll consider them otherwise let's end the whole thread here.
by borasalama on October 6th, 2008
1. When an Angel came down and killed thousands of Assyrians on their route to fight Gods people, this was not a miracle of the Assyrians because they encountered an Angel. Yes it was a miracle but not one of the Assyrians. On the other hand Moses and Paul had miracles worked through them, by God.
2. Luke 24:15-32 shows how Jesus was the Promised Seed. So Paul must have know this as well. Paul was an Apostle and lived at the time of the Apostle. Peter gave Paul reconginiton and was even reproved by Paul at one point.
3. Moses was the leader. That is not the point. The point is the ones who he is talking to in that scripture qualify as "brethren" or "brothers" and is not limited to the Ismaelites.
4. You have pointed to a number more than I have. However, I hope you do not mean that is what you base your argument on. I can list more but was afraid you will want to end it. I guess I was rigtht.
by no_one_special on October 6th, 2008
noone...you constantly claim that people are dodging and trying to end threads..you do it in every single one of your threads and then wonder why people don't respond to you...you are becoming your own self-fulfilling prophecy
by Spengo on October 6th, 2008
I have answered your questions and Borasalama. The only instance is when I misunderstood one of you questions but I re-posted it so that it would be clear. If you want to join in and ask me a question do it. See if I do not answer. But when I ask you one, you must answer mine. Agreed?
by no_one_special on October 6th, 2008
I have never not answered one of your questions..but when I do you say "well, according to 3 threads and some scripture that is up for interpretation you are wrong quit dodging" and that doesn't sit well with me. I have never dodged and neither has bora...we might not answer the way you expect we will or how you want us to, but that doesn't mean we are dodging.
by Spengo on October 6th, 2008
Bora has hinted at dodging. And only when the question has implications that he does not agree with. You just come in with random comments. Then we started to discuss and you have not addressed it. Perhaps you have not received it yet but i sent it hours ago. But I see you, bora, and theyann all over the place discussing with everyone and anyone, but you are tired to do it with me.
by no_one_special on October 6th, 2008
wait...so bora has hinted at dodging an implication? That sounds to me like he hasn't done anything...but he might have considered it but not really. I usually just don't want to interrupt and then someone says something that I have a valid interjection for. As for your last point, if you see Bora, Thebyann and myself all over the place having these same arguments and we choose to not do them with you...are you sure the issue is with we who have been consistant or you who immediately says we are dodging when we answer in a way you don't like. If we are consistent with everyone but you...it's likely that the issue is with you....I don't like having debates with you because they go like this "blah blah point againt Islam" "blah blah counterpoint" "YOU ARE DODGING!"
by Spengo on October 6th, 2008
Bora has hinted by saying lets just end it. I have continually asked that he not withdraw. To his credit he at least has had enough courage to continue even when he doesn't like what I am saying. Look through all the conversations we have had. I at least commend him for that. Most people when challenged make a point and when countered, they runaway. Because that's all they had. Bora at least engages me. ..As for seeing you guys everywhere, you guys are still talking about the same subject just with other people. The thing is though they are not far along in the discussions. What I mean is in the threads were myself and you guys participate together, we have gone way past the elementary. It seems you are comfortable debating others who are not familiar with bible or have weak arguments. When presented with a point you will engage, up until it becomes difficult for your position. I have entertained anything you or bora or theybann have thrown at me. The thread speaks for itself.
by no_one_special on October 7th, 2008
And what have I dodged? I told you ask me a question. But then you will answer mine. Do you take that offer? And by the way that is how a debate operates Spengo, point, counter point. And i have said i am more interested in a discussion not a debate. So whenever you would like let me know.
by no_one_special on October 7th, 2008
An interesting answer, it gives me some decent insight and to me is the best answer to the actual question asked at the top. As a Christian I believe the fulfilment of the comforter in bible prophecy by Jesus to be the Holy Spirit (found in Acts 2) I do not to believe it to be a flesh and blood person.
by cscampbell on October 29th, 2008
TY kindly csc. I can understand your position. Your view of it is conditioned somehow. Others can approach it with a more inquisitive mind. Take the first part, for example, it says "he shall give you ANOTHER COMFORTER" now that reads like a reassurance, like saying - although I am going, because I have to, you'll not be lost because you will be getting ANOTHER COMFORTER - So if the first one was flesh and blood you'd expect the replacement to be flesh and blood as well. You see, the unconditioned step by step reasoning.
by borasalama on October 29th, 2008
again, your prophet said the christian and jewish scriptures had been corrupted...so why do muslims point to the scripture to prove muhammed was a prophet...muhammed would not be very hapy with you pointing to corrupt scripture to prove his exsistance....you can not win a rligious debate with me..i am not one of the ignorant masses..i have a full grasp of islam..
by Happy-Dance on October 29th, 2008
If you don't mind my saying so the "i have a full grasp of islam" is just a claim of yours, it doesn't show in the kind of things you've said in your comments so far.
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It's not just the Muslims that are saying exercise caution with the Bible the words "HAS GRAVE DEFECTS" and "these DEFECTS ARE SO MANY and SO SERIOUS as to call for revision . . ." are from orthodox Christian scholars themselves writing about the King James Version of the Bible. Yet it's a version that continues to be very widely used, held in high regard and extensively quoted from, people even swear by it.
by borasalama on October 29th, 2008
yes it does..muslims just are blinded to the truth of the savage nature of islam.....and you dont worry about my bible..muhammed said it was corrupt 1,400 years ago..so it should be of no concern of yours...
by Happy-Dance on October 29th, 2008
Bora always points to the King James to prove his point. But you see the contradiction. If the bible has so many errors and cannot be counted on, why use any scripture from the bible to make a case for Mohamed? See the weakness in that position? Secondly, to further show the inconsistency and blatant misapplication he is quoting John 14:16 "And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;"....HOWEVER HE CONVENIENTLY LEAVES OUT THE VERY NEXT VERSE. John 14:17 "Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you." ... See the last points of the sentence? Dwelleth with you and shall be in you. See that part doesn't sit well with Bora. Not too inquisitive now bora? This obviously cannot refer to Mohamed since he was not dwelling with them nor in them. It can only refer to the Holy Spirit in an increased capacity.
by no_one_special on October 29th, 2008
actually noone..you are arguing Bora's point. The statement says that "the world CAN NOT receive", but the line before says "HE SHALL GIVE", if we can't receive what is already there i.e. the spirit that is within us, what is left to receive but something down the road...another messenger perhaps.
by Spengo on October 30th, 2008
@ Cath Fortunately for the Muslim the corruption of the Bible is not the corruption of his scripture but it is still the corruption of his heritage.
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You could argue that because Muslims grow up in it they become accustomed and "blinded to the truth of the savage nature of islam". There are three observations we can make on this:
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1 that in general it applies to any belief or practice we grow up with - it could apply to you
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2 outsiders looking in will not be "blinded" like those who have grown up knowing no different - belief in the HQ as the guide book began with one man, since then over one billion have joined in from outside, surely they were not blinded and we can trust their judgment that Islam IS NOT savage.
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3 (to continue with your wording) our eyes become open when we come into contact with those who have not grown up so - sensible, learned discussion on AB is one form of this contact. Then let's make our discussions sensible so we can learn from one another.
by borasalama on October 30th, 2008
the word corrupt is used in several places to describe the christain and jewish scripture...i have read dozens of islamic books including the quran itself, please take your arguments to the
ignorant..not for the people that have read for themselves
by Happy-Dance on October 30th, 2008
my religion teaches for us to love our enemy..i love muslims..i hate islam, there is a difference...islam teaches to slay the enemy..yes yes yes..i know that the quran say christians and jews are people of the book..but they are speaking of people that practiced from the uncorrupted scripture..which according to muhammed did not even exsist during his time..they say all those who pray to other than god are infidels...they claim jesus is not god and that that was clear in the "origial" sciptures..therefore all christians today are infidels..do research for yourself if you do not believe me..
by Happy-Dance on October 30th, 2008
cathy...please link me one passage of the Koran that actually has the word "bible" or "biblical" or "corrupted scripture" in it. Much like "Jihad" there is a misunderstanding to the truth, I am not trying to put you on the spot or call you anything other than truthful, but you claim to have read the Koran but there are no mentions in the Koran of the bible. The Koran is the final word in Islam, so please tell me, as a Muslim, where should I go to learn of this corruption to practice my savage faith properly?
by Spengo on October 30th, 2008
doesnt use the words bible or biblical, they only use the word scriptures....you will have to give me a bit of time to do my gogle cut and paste majic but okay...no prob..
by Happy-Dance on October 30th, 2008
I'll save you some time cathy http://quod.lib.umich.edu/k/koran/ is the best online Koran I've ever found...it has word searches...just search for those words and see how many times it comes up
by Spengo on October 30th, 2008
extend and add to that search "infidel" "honor killing" and "jihad". You will only find some of Jihad but the proper definition and time for it...when you find some that are questionable...read the entire surah and you will understand that as well.
by Spengo on October 30th, 2008
@Spengo. I did not make bora's point unless one takes things out of context. Let us look at the context, John 14:16,17 "I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may be with you forever; that is the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it does not see Him or know Him, but you know Him because He abides with you and will be in you."
At first it may appear as if this helper may be a person. However, the very next verse identifies the helper as the "Spirit of the truth." One may still argue that this still may apply to a person, however, as we continue reading the passage further clarification is given when it is said, "you know Him because He abides with you and will be in you." Do you see there is no way this can apply to a person since it made clear that "He abides with them already" and "will be in them" so this can only mean the Holy Spirit in an increased capacity.
by no_one_special on November 1st, 2008
But the Holy Spirit is God...how do you increase God's capacity? That doesn't even make sense. The interesting thing is that you keep using biblical scripture, which we don't follow. We use it because it it true to you...but it holds less bearing to us. If you wish to debate Islam, shouldn't you do so with the Koran? Site Islamic sources for me when "disproving" Islam, but we will use Biblical when speaking of Christianity.
by Spengo on November 1st, 2008
-3 DR - still can't find even one statement to make against, either the above answer or my other answers that you have DRed?
by borasalama on March 29th, 2009
@Spengo. The Holy Spirit is not God. And if you quote scriptures from the bible, is it not logical for one to use biblical reference to counter? I am not debating Islam but your use of the bible to support Islam. If Islam is not dependent on the bible do not use it as a source. Sounds logical to me.
by no_one_special on May 30th, 2009
Your comment is specifically aimed at Spengo, so I'll not address it directly .
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I'll just shed some light on the background from which my inputs have come, in the hope that it will help you understand that Muslims are NOT trying to justify Islam through the Bible.
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From an Islamic perspective
1- ALL prophets from the first one, Adam, through Noah, Abraham, Moses Jesus and many others to the final one, Mohammed, came with the SAME central message
>>>a- God is one
>>>b- submit to His will
2- a+b is the definition for the word "Islam"
3- It follows from 1 and 2 that
>>>a- ALL prophets taught Islam, and
>>>b- they and their followers were Muslims
>>>c- it's not surprising there'a a lot in common between them all
4- the detailed laws changed over the ages
5- the only scripture binding on today's Muslims is the HQ
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So you see, though they're no longer bound by them, Muslims recognise quite a bit from *ALL* earlier scriptures and will often quote from them.
by borasalama on May 31st, 2009
all scripture binding is a misleading statement..muslims say they believe in the scripture of the jews and christians..they say they believe that the aforementioned scriptures have been changed and no longer exsist in their true form...yet they can not produce any other scipture to place against it..they say they believe in the original scripture of the christians and jews...yet they have no original scripture.......so therefore they believe in nothing but conjecture..
by Happy-Dance on May 31st, 2009
muhammed was born many years after the death and resurection of christ...jesus was a jew..sorry..a zionist jew no less....who loved israel and promised that they would be dispersed but reformed in the end times....THERE IS ONLY ONE ISLAMIC ROPEHET AND HIS NAME IS MUHAMMED...during a dug induced haze he "saw and heard" the angel gabriel...lol..then he proceeded to get an erection from the sight of a naked 9 year old girl and have sex with her...that is all I have to know...muHAMMED WAS A PIG....A HARAAAM...DIRTY FILTHY PEDOPHILE..WARLORD PIG..AND HE IS ROTTING IN HELL AS WE SPEAK
by Happy-Dance on May 31st, 2009
TY Cathy, if you quote from your scripture to support your statements then maybe we can discuss the matter further. Till then I leave you with the greeting of the Bible (Genesis 43:23, Luke 24:36) and the HQ, as used by Muslims to this day - salam eleikom.
by borasalama on May 31st, 2009
@bora. I see where you are going with you A plus B thing. Given your definition, which I disagree with, how do does the word Muslim come into the picture? Again I see your attempt to show a logical way of of calling the other prophets as being from Islam. But what is the definition of Muslim?
Do you see given your definition, Jews are Islamic and do not even know about it! Why? Because they believe in one God and to submit to his will.
Guess who else is Islamic?? Non Trinitarian Christians, since they also believe in one God and submission to his will.
Your definition is to broad. You make it that way to fit your argument, otherwise it would not make sense. However by doing so you defeat your own position.
by no_one_special on May 31st, 2009
Alhamdulillah! I think you've got it. Now, you probably know where I'm coming from. Now, perhaps, you understand better (but not necesssarily agree with) all the things I was saying in many of our earlier conversations.
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I see there are still one or two loose ends to sort out.
Islam - I'm afraid the definition of this word is not my work. That's what the word means. If the Oneness of God is UNCOMPROMISING and the submission to His will is TOTAL then that is Islam. That is why in the HQ ALL who were sent by God (the Messengers of God) are referred to as preaching and practising Islam.
Muslim - this word is derived from the word Islam so a Muslim is simply anyone that regards God as uncomromisingly One and strives to totally submit to His will.
Judaism and Christianity - Moses did not name what he was teaching "Judaism" neither did Jesus say that he had come with a religion called "Christianity", but there is no doubt they both taught Islam, as defined.
by borasalama on May 31st, 2009
more muslim double talk.......why would you want me to quote from my scripture if Muslims believe my scripture to be corrupt.....and gretings from the bible, the same bible that Muslims feel has been infiltrated with lies and deceptions is quite the hypocritical thing for a Muslim to do..my bible says the convenat is with the child of abraham and sarah...and that ishmael is a wild ass of a man and his decendants will bring nothing but trouble where ever they go..
by Happy-Dance on May 31st, 2009
Cathy, Islam does not teach hatred of people on racial or religious grounds. Muslim's view is that anything that is harmful, including abusive language, cannot be a teaching from God no matter which scripture it comes from. The HQ says one people should not look down upon or despise another, it also says God will be the judge between people regarding their beliefs and deeds.
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The Muslim accepts all parts of earlier scriptures that are consistent with the uncompromising oneness of God and the requirement to submit to His will exclusively as being genuinely from God.
by borasalama on May 31st, 2009
seems like you are unfamilar with your own quran..i am doing laundry..when i come back I will answer more completly
by Happy-Dance on May 31st, 2009
Great! So we are all Muslims! Hooray we are all saved due to Christ ransom sacrifice. So long as we have one God and submit. Right Bora????? Oh wait you don't believe in the sacrifice. Does that mean we are no longer Muslim? We still have one God and submit to his will. So what do you say bora?
by no_one_special on May 31st, 2009
To submit to the will of God means to be wanting to do what He wants us to do - to live according to His instructions. To communicate these instructions to us God appointed selected persons amongst us to be His messengers. These messengers glorified God only and showed us how to live according to God's will. On their departure the messengers left us with scriptures to be our guide until the appointment of the next messenger.
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God tailored the details of His instructions to suit the time, the place and the people. So, if we take Noah's era as an example, those who followed Noah believing in the only true God and submitting to His will as explained by Noah, then they were Muslims, by definition. The same applies to those who lived in the era of each of God's many other messengers, including Abraham, Moses and Jesus.
by borasalama on June 1st, 2009
So are modern day Christians and Jew, Muslim?
by no_one_special on June 1st, 2009
FOR STARTERS..because i have to leave for school....
everyine please google to following..
surah 5:51
surah 9:12
surah 9:27
surah 9:31-9:37
I saw so many surahs that speak of the condemnation by muslims based on religion it is not funny....they spare not even the christians and jews....we all need to be done away with..i will post more tonight when I get home from school
by Happy-Dance on June 1st, 2009
noone, your comment was so short I nearly missed it.
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ALL God’s messengers were Muslims and taught Islam (both words by definition) It logically follows then that anyone who truly followed them was a true Muslim.
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However, what if someone said to Moses I follow Abraham. Moses would be entitled to say that from now on he was the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by him. That was his job, to be the new guide.
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Or what if they started taking on the teachings of others, after Moses, and deviated from the laws of God brought by Moses. Even if they claim to follow Moses by finding obscure justifications in him for their new teachings, Moses would still be entitled to say that in vain do they honour him, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
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But as HQ 6:164 says:
- "Shall I seek for (my) Cherisher other than God, when He is the Cherisher of all things (that exist)?
- Every soul draws the fruits of its acts on none but itself: no bearer of burdens can bear the burden of another.
- Your goal in the end is towards God. HE WILL TELL YOU (all of us) THE TRUTH OF THE THINGS WHEREIN YE DIFFERED."
by borasalama on June 1st, 2009
Cathy, I feel sorry for you. You've allowed your mind to be filled with hatred from the many hate mongers out there. I wouldn't judge Christians by listening to hate mongers neither should you have judged the 1.4 billion Muslims by listening to hate mongers. I doubt whether in your state of mind you will even bother to read let alone reflect upon any explanation I give, but nevertheless, I have said someting related to your point @ http://www.answerbag.com/a_view/4009849 and
http://www.answerbag.com/a_view/2999593 May the God that Jesus prayed to guide us all to peace - salam eleikom.
by borasalama on June 1st, 2009
So can a Christina or Jew be Muslim if they feel they are doing God's will?
by no_one_special on June 2nd, 2009
noone, as I said up there, 'To submit to the will of God means to be wanting to do what God wants us to do - to live according to His instructions' God knows best what is best for us, after all He created us. However, the instructions that all these messengers came with were not identical as I said above 'God tailored the details of His instructions to suit the time, the place and the people'. I also described a hypothetical scenario that answers your latest question. Imagine some people of Moses saying to him that they'd prefer to stick to the teachings of Abraham. Moses could tell them that from the time God appointed him (Moses) as the messenger he (Moses) was the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, except by him (Moses). That was his job, to be the new guide. Any from the people of Moses who rejected Moses was rejecting God's will and, by definition, they were NOT Muslims.
by borasalama on June 3rd, 2009
The problem with your example is this would be disobedience and preference. My question is not based on either. It is based on ignorance, sincere, but nonetheless ignorance on the one practicing these religions. Would a Modern day Jew or Christian be a Muslim by your definition? IN fact what about Hindu or any other religions so long as they sincerely submitted to the will of God.
by no_one_special on June 3rd, 2009
you're absolutely right the scenario I described fits squarely into the disobedience category. Sorry, I didn't know your question was about ignorance.
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If a person was genuinely ignorant of the appointment of a later messenger but strived to learn and follow the genuine teachings of the previous messenger then reason tells us he is a Muslim, by definition.
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However, there is in all rational men a duty to seek, enquire and evaluate. If we apply these methods to get the best value for our money when buying, say, a car or a washing machine then God, Who blessed us with the analytical mind, would expect us to apply them even more crtically in seeking His Truth. How genuinely we sought God is known only to Him. HQ 6:164 quoted in full above ends by saying our "goal in the end is towards God. HE WILL TELL YOU (all of us) THE TRUTH OF THE THINGS WHEREIN YE (we) DIFFERED"
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"Hinduism" is NOT mentioned as the religion taught by the Vedas or any other main "Hindu" scripture. ALL major theistic religions taught Islam, as defined, including so called "Hinduism".
by borasalama on June 3rd, 2009
So by the definition you give, everyone that believes in a higher divine power, is Muslim. So long as they are sincere and ignorant. Correct?
by no_one_special on June 3rd, 2009
you have to qualify the word ignorant to mean what I meant it to mean, because as it stands, without any explanation, your summarising statement obviously doesn't make much sense. And, btw, I don't think I said "a higher divine power" I said God. To be precise the One who sent all those messengers, and the one all the messengers prayed to and taught their followers to pray to. The one whom Jesus calls "thee the ONLY True God".
by borasalama on June 3rd, 2009
What I mean is if one believes in God and submits to his will, by your definition, he is a Muslim. Correct?
by no_one_special on June 13th, 2009
yes, I think so, but with less emphasis on the definition being mine and more concern on getting the definition right.
by borasalama on June 14th, 2009
I think that you guys are talking about 2 different things. noone, you are speaking of the actual word definition of "muslim" lower-case for the actual word. Bora is speaking of Muslims upper-case as a group of people and a proper name/title. Technically noone is correct by word definition. Bora is also right based on title.
by Spengo on June 15th, 2009
salam eleikom Spengo how are you doing
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Problem here is many people don't realise in the HQ Abraham, Moses, Jesus are called Muslims.
by borasalama on June 15th, 2009
I see what you are saying Spengo. Thank you for that. Then the question must be were Jesus and the prophets Muslim by title?
by no_one_special on June 16th, 2009
Yes, I could say to be a Muslim during any period of time was to submit to the will of God as communicated by the messenger for that period of time.
by borasalama on June 17th, 2009
I see your position. Don't agree but I understand it now. Thanks Bora.
by no_one_special on June 19th, 2009
TY, you can now understand the reason and logic behind our beliefs.
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I leave you with the greeting of God, of Jesus, of those before him (Judges 6:23, Genesis 43:23 Luke 24:36) and of Muslims to this day - salam eleikom
by borasalama on July 2nd, 2009
Another classic. :D
by no_one_special on May 3rd, 2010
by Oor Galooly - on August 2nd, 2008
One of Jesus`s prophecies was that there would be many false prophets after me, and they will lead many astray.
Yes Galooly 1 John 4:1-3 warns "Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world. Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God"
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The HQ confirms that Jesus came and was that prophesied Messiah. In fact it mentions Jesus by name 500% times more than Mohammed. Here's just one example
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HQ 4:171 “O People of the Book! Commit no excesses in your religion: Nor say of God aught but the truth. Christ Jesus the son of Mary WAS an apostle of God, and His (God’s) Word, which He bestowed on Mary, and a spirit from Him (God): so believe in God and (all) His apostles. And say not "Trinity" desist! it will be better for you: for God is one God. Glory to Him: (it cannot be) that He has a son. To Him belong all in the heavens and all on earth. And enough is God as a Disposer of affairs.”
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HQ 33:40 declares Muhammad "the Messenger of God, and the Seal (final) of the Prophets" meaning all who claim to be prophets after him are false.
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Mohammed passes the "genuine" test with flying colours. Now the test is on us, do we accept Mohammed?
by borasalama on August 3rd, 2008
Note that 1John says to test the inspired expression. How do we do that? 2 Timothy 3:16,17 tells us to us the bible. Islam when tested with the bible does not hold up. Galatians 1:8 "But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let him be eternally condemned!"...There is no allowance for new teachings after Jesus.
by no_one_special on September 18th, 2008
muahmmed is the messenger of satan
by Happy-Dance on October 28th, 2008
Hmm, I'm sure you've good reasoning powers what then do you make of this:
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HQ 16: 98 "So when you recite the Quran, seek refuge with God from the accursed Satan"
Considering Muslims read the HQ several times everyday and given that there are 1.4 billion Muslims around the world that's a lot of curses on Satan.
Do you think there is or has ever been ANY other community in the world that curses Satan as much as the Muslims? So would you still think it's sane to say "muahmmed is the messenger of satan"?
by borasalama on October 29th, 2008
many will come in my name after me..beware of false prophets for they shall come in sheeps clothing and pretend to be righteous...when women are stoned to death for being raped..when girls are lined up and shot for not wanting to marry there fathers choices..when christians and jews have there heads hacked of n the name of alah on live t.v....yes it is the religion of satan...the best friends of satan where sheeps clothing..love your muhammed if you choose but he will got get you into heaven
by Happy-Dance on October 29th, 2008
I'm sorry but where there's hatred there's nothing worth learning, so you'll have to excuse me this time, salaam eleikom.
by borasalama on October 29th, 2008
Galooly, liz's reference. Look and learn -"Isaiah prophesised the coming of Muhammad in the book of Isaiah chapter XXI13-16. Kedar is Arabia, Tema is Medina and Dedan is Mecca. Compare this ols Arabian map with a modern one. Tema is in the exact place as Medina and Dedan is in the exact place as Mecca. Muhammad migrated Mecca from persecution where the people of Tema greeted and welcomed him"
cat, Mahommad will not get us into heaven, only Allah can do that.
by Theby on October 31st, 2008
cat, "muahmmed is the messenger of satan" - where do it say this? Or is it just your own reckoning? cat, You have NO knowledge of Islam, you ignore references, you lie, you do not listen. Ergo (look it up) I no longer wish to listen to your nonsense. A'salaam Eleikom.
by Theby on October 31st, 2008
your muhammed was had sex with a 9 year old..i will say no more...yeah i will she was his favorite wife...he like playing with his baby best of all..the man was sick, that is all the knowledge of islam needed..if he lived today he would be sitting in a prison cell
by Happy-Dance on October 31st, 2008
get off the computer your muslim husband will be home soon and expect you to have the house cleaned and dinner on the table..and make sure everything is exactly the way HE LIKES it..when you let that one slip, boy oh boy did you let the cat out of the bag..you gave up your entire identity for a man....did you get him his greencard..lol
by Happy-Dance on October 31st, 2008
omg..i cant get over it...christian chick, marries muslim dude..realizes she crewed up, but has to keep face...she cant admitt she hates her life so she makes believe she loves islam so people wont feel sorry for her..
by Happy-Dance on October 31st, 2008
Cat, that`s exactly how I see things. Thestupidbunny is in deep pain and in denial. She is to be pitied more than anything, as are most women married to muslim men.
by Oor Galooly - on October 31st, 2008
Cath, are you sure you love the Jesus, the Christ?
by borasalama on October 31st, 2008
Mr Bean, you are back. Glad you changed your avatar. Now you look like Herman Munster.
by Theby on November 1st, 2008
I get so upset with posts like this. People are trying so hard to make Muslims look in a way that they aren't. Galooly...please give me one instance of a time that a muslim SPECIFICALLY WRONGED YOU IN THE NAME OF ISLAM. Not something from the news...but something from personal experience....same for you cathy.
by Spengo on November 1st, 2008
Spengo, Don't get upset with these people. They are ignorant and will never listen to reason. They are doomed. Insh'Allah, we are not. Feel pity for them. Asalaam Aleikom.
by Theby on November 1st, 2008
I just get irritated that people spew such hatred in the name of peace and think they are making a peaceful world doing so. Nothing good can come of evil and that is all I see from some members here. I know that you live in a very non-muslim environment...I believe Australia has a lower % per capita of Muslims than the United States...but I also imagine you don't have the blind hatred.
by Spengo on November 1st, 2008
In the city I live in, only 800,000 people...we have 1 mosque. It isn't very large, but it doesn't have to be. There are only about 400 members and it is the only mosque within about 100 miles in any direction. I live in the "Bible Belt" in the Central Midwestern US. There is a church on almost every city block here. I can't profess my faith anywhere but in the solitude of my home or the mosque without receiving ridicule and having people around me filled with fear or hatred. I mean no one harm...but I believe that Muhamed was the final prophet, so people think that I do. It builds up for me and sometims it boils over here.
by Spengo on November 1st, 2008
On some of these Muslim sites I do. Australia does not have many Muslims but the ones that are here are subjected to hatred every day. Australians can be very bigoted.
by Theby on November 1st, 2008
I remember one time that My wife and I went out to a charity dinner...we were both in proper clothing, her in a Hijab and Abaya, myself in my Furwah and Egal. A mother actually pulled her children away from us because she thought we were somehow a threat to their kids. As I said, we were on our way to a charity dinner for the hospital that I work at. The hatred disgusts me and I sometimes have troubles dealing with it all. In public, most people either, a)know about Islam and aren't afraid b)know nothing but are apathetic or c) know nothing and spew hatred. Sadly, c is the largest percentage.
by Spengo on November 1st, 2008
I'm sorry to hear about this. I want to move to Australia but I want to move somewhere that my children won't be subject to this blind hatred. In a year or so I will be taking a vacation down there...I would be honored to take you and your husband out to dinner with my wife and I. I will keep you up to date as time gets closer to see if we could make this work.
by Spengo on November 1st, 2008
Spengo, I am so sorry to hear of your unpleasant incident. She was definately a "C". I was in my husband's shop one day and a girl came in and started abusing the customers. My husband asked her to please leave. She then bacame abusive to my husband and told him to, "go back to your own country. This country is for Aussies only". I had only just reverted to Islam at this stage and became very upset. I told her my husband had as much right to be in Australia as her. She took a swing at me and I (much to my shame) reacted by swinging back. Con'd
by Theby on November 1st, 2008
My husband and his friend had to separate us. I have learnt to control myself now. But, on the bright side, there are Mosques here that are always full. I made my final decision to revert after listening to a talk by Yusuf Estes. Have you heard of him? My husband and I would be very happy for you and your wife to contact us when you come to Australia. We have lots of Muslim friends and we can all take you to a great Islamic restaurant. My prayers are with you and your wife. Goodbye, Brother. Salaam
PS If you need any help re your trip from this end, please let me know.
by Theby on November 1st, 2008
I don't know if both of you, sis Theby and bro Spengo, are racially in the majority in the areas you live in, in Islam, of course, your race matters not a bit, but if you are then you don't suffer as much as the Muslims who are racially in the minority in their areas. They have to put up with a double dose of uncivilised behaviour, one on account of their religion and again on account of their race. Like those who shouted "go back to your own country" at sis Theby's husband. Such behaviour is bigotry stemming from the dark depths of ignorance. Attempting to bring the elightenment of education to such is a very daunting and painful task, but we must carry on with it. I admire the effort both of you are putting in this and it's my humble request that you don't give up no matter how hurtful.
by borasalama on November 1st, 2008
Nothing compares to the discrimination and persecution perpetrated on the Christians in muslim lands. You lot are full of shit and you know it. You want to fight racism and bigotry? Go to any muslim country and start there. Obviously you don't give a toss, anyone with half a brain sees through your facade of caring.
by Oor Galooly - on November 1st, 2008
now compare the language you've used, and you're not alone in that, with the language used by Muslims here on AB and come back and let me know what you find. Do you really want to be so Christless?
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What kind of "persecution perpetrated on the Christians in muslim lands" are you talking about? In this thread you have read of just a bit of the real disgusting behaviour of these Christless Christians towards Muslims and other minorities.
by borasalama on November 1st, 2008
Just calling a spade a spade, and language doesn't kill anyone. I wonder if I went onto a muslim website and spoke the way muslims spoke on here what sort of treatment I would get.
by Oor Galooly - on November 1st, 2008
I have added a bit more to my last comment.
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I agree your language "doesn't kill anyone", but it is indicative of your attitude, it can be deeply hurtful, it puts hatred in people. Those are not worthy aims by anyone's standards let alone those of Christ.
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"the way muslims spoke on here"? They'll ask searching questions to find out what the Bible says, what's wrong with that. They show the utmost respect to Jesus. If you have similar respect you can ask ANY question on the HQ on a Muslim website. If you want examples of how disrespectful Christless Christians can be look at some of the questions and answers posted on the Islam sections of AB.
by borasalama on November 1st, 2008
there is a reason i say only one muslim here converted for her husband and is trapped...but yet I do not say the same about other muslims on this site...she slipped up..posted something then deleted it...read the responses i posted...it isnt clear why i responded the way i did is it??? because what i responded to was deleted....god knows everything and you can deny with your last breath, but you can not really deny, because who you are is not in your words..it is imbedded in your heart and mind
by Happy-Dance on November 3rd, 2008
lol...i have never insulted a muslim onthis site..i have said many times i think the vast majoriy of muslims are decent people that have been lead astray by a false religion...and i have been personally attacked..the best of what i have been called is stupid and an idiot...words i have never used to describe anyone on this sight..as for my shock therapy...trust me even if she doesnt admitt it..i have her thinking...and there are places for her to go...
by Happy-Dance on November 3rd, 2008
as far as mosque are concerned I have about 5 in a three square mile area, because the muslims in the community built them.....do you expect someone else to build your mosque for you??????christians built their own churches...jews there own temples..i even have a buddist temple in my neighborhood they built themselves....stop whining and do something..it may take years to raise the money...but if you want a mosque..build one..take donations...apply for aid from islamic organizations, but for crying out loud stop whining
by Happy-Dance on November 3rd, 2008
Cath, interesting comments but I'm not sure whose points you're responding to?
by borasalama on November 3rd, 2008
cathy...I wasn't complaining about the mosque...I was just making a statement that there isn't a need for more due to such a low number of Muslims in the area which makes me a minority by miles. As far as people building their own places of worship...I, as a muslim, have built 3 christian churches with a mission in the Dominican. I believe that worshipping anything is better than worshiping nothing and my Aunt lives there on mission so I went to help her. I have nothing against any other person of any other belief. It's not for me to judge, you however seem to think it's your place to tell someone that you don't know about how her marriage is working out. It's not your place since you don't know. If you had ACTUAL REASONABLE EVIDENCE that theby's marriage wasn't proper, then you could address it properly, but you have no grounds so you are overstepping in a big disrespectful way
by Spengo on November 4th, 2008
Ah, TY Spengo, it's a bit clearer, and I can attempt a sensible comment or two now.
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Cath, Please clarify the following:
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I said "your language ..is indicative of your attitude, (and) it can be deeply hurtful". Now, according to you, "who you are IS NOT in your words..it IS IMBEDDED in your heart and mind" If that's the case how do YOU know Theby "converted for her husband and is trapped"?
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You claim "i have NEVER insulted a muslim onthis site" did you seriously think Theby would not be insulted by all the things you've said about her? And don't you think you're insulting all Muslims, 1.4 billion of them, by calling their religion false?
by borasalama on November 4th, 2008
first of all my religion is called false in the quran ..they call my scripture corrupted...secondly, it is a given that christians believe islam is a false religion and muslims believe chritians practice a false religion...false being not true.as muslims claim to practice the true religion of god...so do not say that by me sayng islam is a false religion I am insulting all muslims....if I didnt believe it was a false religion, I would be muslim...so that is a given
by Happy-Dance on November 4th, 2008
second, as far as the post Thebyann deleted...if she deleted them I will not speak of them....the response i posted was posted, in conversation with her....she deleted her post...and if would have been left at that..it would of been over..however the personel attacks escalated, because all people saw was my response and didnt see what i was responding to....fact is I read something very revealing.and responded to it...in the context of the "complete conversation" my answer makes sense....and it is not up to me repost what she said....number one because if she wanted people to read it, it would still be posted...and number two..i dont remember word for word exactly what she said, and if I tried to repost it it would not be fair to express her feelings in my words rather than her own
by Happy-Dance on November 4th, 2008
spengo...not buying it...sorry..muslims dont build churches..if it is true you are a nominal muslim at best...it is way way way way against islam to build a house where others are worshipped as god....remember christians believe jesus is god..so building a house to worship jesus equal in islam to building a house to pray to the golden calf...and as thebyann will never post her deleted post again..you will never understand what happened so....please dont try
by Happy-Dance on November 4th, 2008
cathy...I am not a liar. I have spent a great portion of my life in bad places doing bad things, I converted when I finally realized that I wasn't the cause of all events on earth. I was raised in a strictly Christian family. My Aunt was on missions...my Gma actually lives in a house that is in the parking lot of her church...she worked there and retired there and then worked there for free because it was the polite thing to do.
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As for your statement that we see Christianity as false, that is only half-true. We believe that Christians are people of the book. If you know anything about Islam you can not argue that simple fact. The Koran says that Jews and Christians can get into heaven...if you have read the Koran you know that simple fact. If someone has never worshiped and doesn't know God and doesn't live properly, they can NOT get into heaven. So helping build a church for people OF THE BOOK that CAN GET INTO HEAVEN, though not following the doctrine I follow, is a noble
by Spengo on November 4th, 2008
thing to do. Calling me a "nominal muslim" is a personal attack on my faith and what we in the real world would call "the beginnings of an insult" you are insulting my belief and my convictions when you do not know me. You are making as much sense as me stating that I don't think you are a good person because your hair is both blonde and purple and that all your piercings make you look scary to children. I think you should change your clothes more often.
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As you read that I'm sure you are saying to yourself "that doesn't make sense" or "that just isn't true". That is how I feel about your statements about me as a "nominal muslim" You don't know me, my past, my life, my thoughts, my hopes, my dreams, my goals. Don't tell me that you know my faith.
by Spengo on November 4th, 2008
Can a Christian get into heaven if he doesn't believe in Mohamed or the Koran or if they believe Jesus to be the only begotten son of God? If not then Islam does disqualify Christians since none of those can a Christian accept.
by no_one_special on November 4th, 2008
they dance around everything...they will say a muslim man can marry a christian woman...then they say the only way to heaven is through islam....lol, how do all you uslims feel knowing your wives are doomed to hell
by Happy-Dance on November 4th, 2008
its all about breeding.this is why a man can have so many wives..if each muslim man takes four wives to breed with, there are not enough muslim woman..so they had to open up the door..include christian and jewsih woman..and ofcorse mandate that these children be muslim..
by Happy-Dance on November 4th, 2008
Hey I wonder can a Muslim woman marry a Christian man?
by no_one_special on November 4th, 2008
omg...please dont make me go through that again..the short answer is no
by Happy-Dance on November 4th, 2008
I agree with cathy...the answer is no. However, Cathy has just stepped into a place we call assumptive belief. There are no doctrines, rules, laws, writings, or fables that agree with her about the mating situation. This is purely conjecture. I'm sorry that you hate Islam so much that you will openly lie to everyone and mask it behind statements like "I know more about it than you". I'm sorry, but I just will not respond to these radical statements. Please stop trolling me as I just want to answer questions and have open debate but you bring emotion and negativity which negates objectivity.
by Spengo on November 4th, 2008
hey pick up your koran..for crying out loud....it is a sad day when i give surah from your own quran and you say it is purley conjecture...it is good for a laugh...much love
by Happy-Dance on November 4th, 2008
I never said it was conjecture. I said that you were misinterpreting. The Koran says that people of the book Jews and Christians can get into heaven. I don't see that as conjecture...that is black and white.
by Spengo on November 4th, 2008
if you worhip anyone other than god you can not get to heaven according to islam..christains pray to god the ather and god the son (jesus).therefore christian can not get into heaven acording to islam...it is so simple..
by Happy-Dance on November 4th, 2008
and your own quran makes clear the rules of marriage...they are the same for both men and women..do not marry disbelievers..it it is simple.all of the islamic law changing that to men and woman having different criteria for marriage comes from hadith...once again please study your own religion..
by Happy-Dance on November 4th, 2008
I know my own religion and when I have time I will post all of this. The problem is that the bulk of my time for AB is when I'm at work and my work comp has issues posting comments. I'll do my best to over the next 2 days that I have off but I have to see a surgeon and a knee specialist in regards to an upcoming surgery, I have an exam for one of my classes and I have 3 hours of physical therapy tomorrow. I don't have much time, but I will try. The Koran, in the chapter titled "the woman" near the beginning of it, shows these things, I don't have time to post, but I will when I get the chance.
by Spengo on November 4th, 2008
I have read it many times...and now I feel guilty..go have your surgery...we can fight when you are recovered..
by Happy-Dance on November 4th, 2008
Cath, having read your responses I find myself repeating "your language ..is indicative of your attitude" and towards Islam that does appear quite derisory.
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A Muslim is delighted to have a faith group so close to it and have it mentioned by name and with respect in his scripture. He's intrigued by how this faith came to depart from strict monotheism and he's prepared to discuss this at length. Some Christians, however, regard Islam with hostility, believe it to be devil-inspired and consider it their religious duty to undermine it.
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"the post Thebyann deleted" if this post was a comment, how do you delete a comment?
by borasalama on November 4th, 2008
it was in this line of comments...i dont know ask a moderator, if there is one...but anyone reading my response can see it was an obvious response to something...however the something is no longer there..
by Happy-Dance on November 4th, 2008
some muslms regard christians with hostility..hence heads being cut off on television...and we are not close.the core fundamental belief of our religion is rejected by islam....thats like saying you love sandwiches, but hate bread....
by Happy-Dance on November 4th, 2008
the "heads being cut off on television" are very rare, please count them, they stick in the mind because they're dramatic, they are confined to hot spots, DO NOT have the backing of Islam and have simple political explanations. The hatred of Islam by Christians on the other hand is more widespread, more indiscriminate and driven by race and creed hatred, verging on bigotry which firmly shuts out any reasoning. If you care to look into history the horrors committed by Christians were astronomical in comparison and had the official blessings of the church, but that's a chapter best left closed.
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"and we are not close.the core fundamental belief of our religion is rejected by islam" that is YOUR view, and you can make it as cynical or hateful as you like you CANNOT change the fact that to the Muslim Christianity is a faith close to Islam and mentioned by name and with respect in his scripture. He's intrigued by how the differences came about and will ask endless questions, sometimes quite probing, to find out.
by borasalama on November 4th, 2008
@Bora. So then do you condemn what those men have done in the name of Islam? I do condemn what so called Christians do in the name of God. So please answer that for us.
by no_one_special on November 4th, 2008
I absolutely condemn the beheadings. I condemn any form of torture and unnecessary death. The Koran does not support these things and neither do I
by Spengo on November 4th, 2008
Thank you Spengo. It shows you are at least brave enough to voice you opinion even if others are not willing.
by no_one_special on November 4th, 2008
depends on any ones persons interpretation of the quran..apparently the people doing the beheading believe they a doing the work of allah...and more importantly they read from the quran at times before choping those very few heads off....mind you these are the "few" that make the news...
by Happy-Dance on November 4th, 2008
cathy, I would like to point out that most members of the taliban and al-queda are illiterate and misinformed as to what the Koran actually says by evil manipulaters and people perverting the doctrine to fit their agenda. If one can not read, any book can mean anything.
by Spengo on November 4th, 2008
ONE QUESTION...DO YOU EVER SLEEP???? goodnight
by Happy-Dance on November 4th, 2008
If you're referring to the beheadings yes of course, we all condemn that. For my part I'd like to invite you to call as many as you can to join the growing number now condemning the worst and most brutal apartheid state the world has ever seen emerging. For a summary see http://www.answerbag.com/a_view/1404376 @ for nore information see http://www.workers.org/2007/world/occupation-0614/ and http://www.aztlan.net/jews_against_zionism.htm
by borasalama on November 5th, 2008
I love israel...always have and alawys will..proaganda is lost on me...more muslims kill there fellow muslis everyyear that a jewish sate could possibly.....loved the rocket attack this morning...when israel realiates..and it will..you will call that brutal...ah well
by Happy-Dance on November 5th, 2008
when you convert do they send the pod people in to steal ALL of your common sense..r do they slip the kool aid in your wadu water..
by Happy-Dance on November 5th, 2008
see cathy...that's the kind of aggressive statement that has no bearing on open conversation. Those statements are why I am done speaking with you.
by Spengo on November 5th, 2008
oh spengo...I'm coverting to messianic Judaism.. as they are jews who accepted there messiah jesus christ..it will be a change..i will have to keep kosher..but i am asking calls for my mitzfa. Yes ladies and gentleman i am going to be a jew....so I take all attacks on Judaism, israel, jesus and my brthern christians as personal attacks
by Happy-Dance on November 5th, 2008
That doesn't negate the fact that you are attacking Muslims.
by Spengo on November 5th, 2008
listen spengo..i dont attack muslims I attack islam...if you cant seperate the two that is on you, not me..most muslims live decent lives..however the religion they follow I find to be false...and BTW I am not converting..just thought it was funny....and if you spend any time at all on answer bag you will find MANY attacks on the christian faith....MANY..and some personal attacks on me....dont here me whining..do you....
by Happy-Dance on November 6th, 2008
Attacking Islam, when it is the one thing of ultimate importance in my life, is an attack on my core beliefs. I don't think making false statements about your belief to be funny. You will find that I haven't perpetrated ANY of the attacks on Christianity on AB or anywhere.
by Spengo on November 6th, 2008
every time you say prophet jesus you attack my core beliefs..he was not a prophet
by Happy-Dance on November 6th, 2008
and the comment about me becomming a jew was directed at the jew haters
by Happy-Dance on November 6th, 2008
Cath, the message about the reality, the gross injustice and brutality of Zionism has reached the church and the orthodox Jews and THEY are all speaking out against it - follow the links and you'll see for yourself. The suffering victims are your fellow Christians abd the Muslims you keep telling us you love so much.
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These Muslims that you love so much, what exactly makes them Muslims, could it possibly be Islam?
by borasalama on November 6th, 2008
these muslims will one day come out oF islam..at least some of them..we are all gods children...minutes after obama was declared the winner of the election 35 missiles were fired into israel..(they doNt want peace they want israel destroyed)..now when israel responds they are called barbaric....TOO BAD..
by Happy-Dance on November 6th, 2008
Cath you say "every time you say prophet jesus you attack my core beliefs..he was not a prophet" well of the people who knew Jesus most and personally too, not one, or a few but “the multitude said, This is Jesus the PROPHET of Nazareth of Galilee.” that's according to Matthew 21:11 if you want to check it up. So these "attacks" was started by those who really knew.
by borasalama on November 6th, 2008
So do you think the British should not have helped liberate France from the Nazi occupation and you would have slammed the French resistance movement?
by borasalama on November 6th, 2008
ARE YOU STUPID??THE FRENCH WHERE FIGHTING FOR THERE OWN COUNRY..ISRAEL FIGHTS TO DEFEND ITSELF.....JERUSALEM IS FOR THE JEWS....KNOW WHO SAID THAT??? DO YOU???YOUR PROPHET MUHAMMED SAID THAT WHEN HE ORDERED THAT MUSLIMS STOP PRAYING TOWARDS JERUSALEM AND START PRAYING TOWARDS MECCA....no mn shall take from the jes what god has given to them..the hand of god protects them...all f the countries around them attacked..arrogantly believing they could defeat gods chosen people...and lol..they where all crushed..amen
by Happy-Dance on November 6th, 2008
and nice twisting of scripture..matthew didnt call jesus a phrophet..he said this is what the people are saying..most of whom did not even ever see jesus or understand what he was..they just heard rumors of miracles...and said he must be a prophet....but nice try..when jesus himself proclaimed himself..god...he said he and god the father where ONE...he also claimed divinity when claiming to have exsted before abraham....before abraham was I.....lol good try though
by Happy-Dance on November 6th, 2008
JESUS DENIES BEING A PROPHET....
John 1:21 They asked him, "What then? Are you Elijah?" And he said, "I am not." "Are you the Prophet?" And he answered, "No."
by Happy-Dance on November 6th, 2008
AND BEFORE YOU SAY THE PROPHET WAS MUHAMMED..AND BEFORE I START LAUGHING THE PROPHET IN QUESTION WAS jOHN THE BAPIST..THE PROPHET THAT MADE MAY FOR JESUS
by Happy-Dance on November 6th, 2008
Dear, oh dear Cath. @ http://www.answerbag.com/a_view/1404376 you'll find a series of maps I think double clicking will enlarge it and you'll see clearly how the Zionists have turned Palestine into Israel. One of the Jewish terror groups, Lehi "known as the Stern Gang, a term coined by the British, was an armed underground Zionist faction in Mandatory Palestine whose goal was to evict, by force, the British authorities from Palestine, ALLOWING UNRESTRICTED IMMIGRATION OF JEWS and the FORMATION OF A JEWISH STATE" the quote is from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stern_Gang and from a Jewish site "There is today a growing number of people of the Jewish faith that recognize that Zionism is in fact counter to the fundamental tenets of the Torah...... Judaism has in many ways been hijacked by Zionism. The Zionists of Israel are not just brutalizing Palestinians, they are also brutalizing genuine Jews.” From http://www.aztlan.net/jews_against_zionism.htm
by borasalama on November 6th, 2008
oh...just stop...i am a zionist..my church is a zionist christian church..the star of david is almost as prominate in my church as the cross is....israel is for the jews....so said your own prophet...so said god...so said my church...said me.....dont need your jew haters telling me anything...jesus was a jew..a jewish rabbi..if he came back today ...hamas would try to blow him up with a bomb...pure evil
by Happy-Dance on November 6th, 2008
So you support injustice and ownership through brutality, Cath? Neither history nor the Orthodox Jews nor an increasing number of Christians agree with your unjust position. That's an undebiable fact, Cath.
by borasalama on November 6th, 2008
there is only one sect of jews that disagree with zionism..and they are the smallest sect the satmars (probably didnt spell it right)..sorry your argument is lost...the bible clearly states those who bless the jews will be blessed and those who curse the jes will be cursed...muslims suffer because they curse the jews..
by Happy-Dance on November 6th, 2008
the Bible supports injustice and brutality?
by borasalama on November 6th, 2008
no..my bible supports truth..something muslims know very little about..
by Happy-Dance on November 6th, 2008
it is your opinion the jews are brutal..it is my opinion that they are defending their right to exsist...but alas..if muslims think they can defeat israel let them try...aa attack on israel is also an atack on god and also an attack on the united states..obama or no obama..the congress will support israel ..amen
by Happy-Dance on November 6th, 2008
simmer down folks...so much anger and hate in regards to so much peace and love. Cathy, you hate Islam and refuse it completely. Bora, you are a devout Muslim...We can all agree that God is all knowing and will make right all things in the end. Cathy, you should at least have the respect to capitalized God which you have never done in a post I've read. There is no point arguing, this thread is starting to get emotive and then it will escalate...lets agree to be the positive peaceful religious people we claim to be and maintain objectivity and truth. Cathy, that involves siting sources.
by Spengo on November 6th, 2008
god isnt taking heaven points away from me because i type fast either in all caps or all lower case letters...my god, the god I believe in places importance on what is in your heart and mind..your love for him and your deep felt belief in him...now can we end this because i am getting sick of scrolling down for two minutes to comment on this question.....SOMEBODY PLEASE END THIS MADNESS....
by Happy-Dance on November 6th, 2008
and spengo my source is my bible...it is the only source i have and you refuse it...
by Happy-Dance on November 6th, 2008
The bible capitalizes God and Him and He in EVERY reference to Him. I don't refuse the bible. I refuse to believe that Jesus died for my sins but that starts a whole different argument. I have read the bible....I was raised Christian...don't say that "my bible supports the truth...something muslims know very little about" because, if the bible is the source of truth, and I know the bible, and I am a muslim...I have negated your point by existing.
by Spengo on November 6th, 2008
i am a christian that studied quran and I negate your point by exsisting............i am unsubscribing to this question.....im sure we will have the same argument on another question...just cant take the scrolling anymore...too many comments on this question...jeeze i wish i could sleep..i have to get up in 5 hours...
by Happy-Dance on November 6th, 2008
dodging the question because you can't scroll a webpage or you chose to not sleep doesn't make you correct on any of your points. If you wish to end the thread so be it, but know that if you troll me or post rubbish like this on any of my other posts, this type of argument will start again. As for my statement about negating you by existing...you said muslims don't know about truth, truth is in the bible. By transitive property, as a Muslim that knows the Bible, I am a Muslim that knows the truth as you understand it. But you said that Muslims don't know about the truth. The fact that I do, and I exist, negates your point. Score one for deductive reasoning.
by Spengo on November 7th, 2008
Cath is an Islamophobe, her hatred of Islam is totally irrational. The hatred she's expressed is so strong you'd think she must have a long list of the harm Islam has done to her, but so far I haven't seen any sign of such a list.
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What she knows about the HQ, or the Bible for that matter, wouldn't be enough to make even the shortest of lists with. Studying the Bible and the HQ with a bit of the depth they deserve requires effort and what she learns might take the wind out of her sails, that's not good when she finds attacking Muslims such great pleasure.
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If she goes further down this path of hatred she might end up becoming a strong Muslim herself. Omar's hatred built up until he could hold it back no more and sword in hand he went out to kill Mohammed. Fourteen centuries have gone and he's still remembered as one of the strongest leaders of Muslims. The lady in the clip @ http://www.answerbag.com/a_view/3649463 perhaps went further than Cath in her hatred, now she comes through as a strong Muslim. So watch out Cath, take it easy :)
by borasalama on November 7th, 2008
Cat, you do not speak of the site I "deleted" because there wasn't one. You carry on about my marrying a Muslim but that is ALL you know. The rest of your comments are pure conjecture. You say of me, "....fact is I read something very revealing.and responded to it...in the context of the "complete conversation" my answer makes sense....and it is not up to me repost what she said...." It IS up to you to report what I supposedly said. You have my permission. Prove yourself. That is a challenge from me to you. Your Islamophobia is palpable and I suspect, bordering on pathological.
by Theby on June 2nd, 2009
by Happy-Dance on June 1st, 2009
again, why are you taking quotes from scriptures and text that islam deems to be corrupt....the quran clearly states that our scriptures are not to be held as accurate...therefore any arguements comming from a muslim based upon them are laughable.
by Happy-Dance on June 1st, 2009
and as far as the biblical prophecies regarding ishmael and his decendants...god know all..from the beginning to the end..and god knew muslims would be against the children of israel...and he makes that known in his holy book...who else but god would know of the problems between the muslims and the jews in the middle east..you dont like these verses of scripture because they hit too close to home and call ishamel, muhammed and all his followers out for who they are..
JESUS CHRIST, speaking to the Jews in the Gospel of St. John, VIII:44
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"Ye are of your father the devil, and the lust of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is not truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar and the father of it.- then answered the Jews - "
(which makes it clear that Christ was addressing the Jews.)
by JESUS-IS-MUSLIM on June 1st, 2009
Teach your self :
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Here are Jewish and christian sources confirm the Jews Blashemy against Jesus (PBUH):
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1- The Jewish Encyclopedia: JESUS OF NAZARETH. (as seen by Jews) ..from the Jewish Encyclopedia http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/view.jsp
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2- Truth about the Talmud: Racist, Rabbinic Hate Literature.
by Michael Hoffman, foremost scholar of Judaism in the English-speaking world http://www.revisionisthistory.org/talmudtruth.html
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3-Talmud Exposed
In A christian website http://www.christusrex.org/www3/talmud-exposed/talmud.htm
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4-The Talmud Destroying Christian Cultures...From a Chrsitain website http://www.jacobisrael.us/talmud.htm
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5- Whos was Jesus? (according to the Jews) .. a Jewish website http://www.noahide.com/yeshu.htm
by JESUS-IS-MUSLIM on June 1st, 2009
Educate yourself:
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From the Jewish holiest Book, The Talmud, talking about Jesus (peace be upon him):
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The Talmud (Babylonian edition) records other sins of "Jesus the Nazarene": http://www.revisionisthistory.org/talmudtruth.html
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1. He and his disciples practiced sorcery and black magic, led Jews astray into idolatry, and were sponsored by foreign, gentile powers for the purpose of subverting Jewish worship (Sanhedrin 43a).
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2. He was sexually immoral, worshipped statues of stone (a brick is mentioned), was cut off from the Jewish people for his wickedness, and refused to repent (Sanhedrin 107b; Sotah 47a).
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3. He learned witchcraft in Egypt and, to perform miracles, used procedures that involved cutting his flesh—which is also explicitly banned in the Bible (Shabbos 104b).
by JESUS-IS-MUSLIM on June 1st, 2009
Educate yourself:
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Here is what is written in the Jewish Encyclopedia about 'Ishmael':
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"Eldest son of Abraham by his concubine Hagar; born when Abraham was eighty-six years of age (Gen. xvi. 15, 16). God promised Abraham that His blessing should be upon Ishmael, who, He foretold, would beget twelve princes and would become a great nation (Gen. xvii. 18, 20)." http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/view.jsp?artid=277&letter=I&search=ishmael
by JESUS-IS-MUSLIM on June 1st, 2009
yawn......dont you understand the fact that you are quoting from the bible is laughable to me....you muslims will say this and that from scripture is untrue..but then turn to it to prove your religion is correct...islam clearly states that the jewish scriptures have been altered..therefore your use of them is ridiculas....either you believe in the scriptures or you dont.....
by Happy-Dance on June 1st, 2009
god promised ishameal a nation, but established his convenant with his brother..the child of sarah and abraham....you muslim like to pick and choose...god is the knower of all...muslims serve their biblical purpose and are quite necessary in the grand scheme of the end time prophecies....their must be evil in the world in the end times..there must be many nations to rise against israel...ishmael is the father of these many nations.....yes he was granted a nation..but no where does it say he was a noble man......he is the father of the nations that will rise against israel, who's covenant lies with his brother....educate yourself
by Happy-Dance on June 1st, 2009
Educate yourself:
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Jesus (peace be upon him) told the Jews that The Kingdom of God (prophethood) will be taken from them and will be given to another NATION:
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"Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof."
[Matthew 21:43]
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Again, keep educating yourself:
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Here is what is written in the Jewish Encyclopedia about 'Ishmael' telling that he was blessed by God (in the bible language, blessing means prophethood):
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"Eldest son of Abraham by his concubine Hagar; born when Abraham was eighty-six years of age (Gen. xvi. 15, 16). God promised Abraham that His blessing should be upon Ishmael, who, He foretold, would beget twelve princes and would become a great nation (Gen. xvii. 18, 20)." http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/view.jsp
by JESUS-IS-MUSLIM on June 1st, 2009
quoting matthew are you...you are funny...does that mean you believe the gospel of matthew to be true......????????
by Happy-Dance on June 1st, 2009
I quote passages from your own bible because I suppose you believe in it not me. Don't you !?
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You either believe totally in what Jesus and your bible say or you reject what's said by Jesus and stated in your own bible!
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It's not pick and choose according to your own desires.
by JESUS-IS-MUSLIM on June 1st, 2009
Was the Awaited Prophet to come from Arabia? .....
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Deuteronomy 33:1-2 combines references to Moses, Jesus and '???'. It speaks of God (i.e. God's revelation) coming from Sinai, rising from Seir and shining forth from PARAN !
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by JESUS-IS-MUSLIM on June 1st, 2009
"Sinai" is a reference to Moses (pbuh). It is an obvious reference to mount Sinai where Moses (pbuh) received his revelation (Exodus 19:20).
by JESUS-IS-MUSLIM on June 1st, 2009
"Seir" is a reference to Jesus (pbuh). It is usually associated with the chain of mountains West and South of the Dead Sea extending through Jerusalem, and Bethlehem, the birthplace of Jesus (pbuh). It was later extended to include the mountains on the East side as well (Dictionary of the Bible, John L. McKenzie, S.J., p. 783). However, Seir is also identified with the Northern border of the tribal territory of Judah and usually with Saris near Kesla (Chesalon), barely nine miles West of these two cities (The Eerdmans Bible Dictionary, by Allen C. Myers, pp. 921-922, and The Interpreter's Dictionary of the Bible, V4, p. 262).
Prophet Moses (pbuh) never in his lifetime entered Palestine, and thus, this could not be a reference to him.
by JESUS-IS-MUSLIM on June 1st, 2009
"Paran" is a reference to the city of Makkah (Mecca) in the Arabian Peninsula. The wilderness of Paran is where Abraham's wife Hagar and his eldest son Ishmael settled (Genesis 21:21) in the Arabian desert, specifically, Makkah. Makkah is, of course, the capital of Islam in Arabia and the birthplace of prophet Mohammed (pbuh). Mount Paran is the chain of mountains in that same region which the Arabs call the "Sarawat mountains". Muhammad (pbuh) received his first revelation in the cave of "Hira'a" located in these mountains. Neither Moses nor Jesus never in their lifes traveled to Paran. Mohammed (pbuh), however, was born there. He became the prophet of Islam there. And it was the capital of the Islamic religion in that day and this. No prophet of the Bible ever came from the Arabian city of Paran (Makkah). Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) is the only prophet of God who has ever fulfilled this prophesy.
by JESUS-IS-MUSLIM on June 1st, 2009
SO NOW MUHAMMED IS GOD....ARE YOU ON CRACK!!!!!!...listen you have a fine way of spinning christian scripture to meet your own needs...why dont you focus on your own book and pray to your own god.....I will pray to the true God
by Happy-Dance on June 1st, 2009
Where did I ever state that Muhammad (peace be upon him) is God. Are you okay?..Because you don't seem to read correctly anything written to you!..It's obvious that the blind hatred filling and darken your heart prevents you from seeing anything but falsehood.
by JESUS-IS-MUSLIM on June 1st, 2009
It seems that you are trying your best to prove the hatred and prejudice statements against women in your Bible:
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[Ecclesiastes 7:25]: "I directed my mind to know, to investigate and to seek wisdom and an explanation, and to know the evil of folly and the foolishness of madness."
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[Ecclesiastes 7:26]: "And I discovered more bitter than death the woman whose heart is snares and nets, whose hands are chains. One who is pleasing to God will escape from her, but the sinner will be captured by her."
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[Ecclesiastes 7:27]: "Behold, I have discovered this," says the Preacher, "adding one thing to another to find an explanation,"
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[Ecclesiastes 7:28]: "which I am still seeking but have not found. I have found one man among a thousand, but I have not found a woman among all these."
by JESUS-IS-MUSLIM on June 1st, 2009
Your bible states that you can find one WISE MAN among a thousand BUT YOU CAN NOT FIND ONE WISE WOMAN!
by JESUS-IS-MUSLIM on June 1st, 2009
Again, [Deuteronomy 33:1-2] combines references to Moses, Jesus and ??? (another PROPHET!).
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It speaks of God (i.e. God's revelation) coming from Sinai, rising from Seir (probably the village of Sa'ir near Jerusalem) and shining forth from Paran. According to Genesis 21:21, the wilderness of Paran was the place where Ishmael settled ( (i.e. Arabia, specifically Mecca (Makkah))!
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Indeed the King James Version of the Bible mentions the pilgrims passing through the valley of Ba'ca (another name for Mecca) in Psalms 84:4-6. Isaiah 42:1-13 speaks of the beloved of God. His elect and messenger who will bring down a law to be awaited in the isles and who "shall not fail nor be discouraged till he have set judgement on the earth." Verse 11 connects that awaited one with the descendants of Ke'dar. Who is Ke'dar? According to Genesis 25:13, Ke'dar was the second son of Ishmael, the ancestor of prophet Muhammad (pbuh).
by JESUS-IS-MUSLIM on June 1st, 2009
nice....your quran says muhammed had sex with a 9 year old...tell me how sick you you have to be to get an erection from a 9 year old
by Happy-Dance on June 1st, 2009
You got a problem with a 50 years old man marrying a 9 years old girl which was a norm 1400 years ago but you have no problem with accepting your supposed false God (Jesus) who's billion of years old to pick a young 12 years old girl, grow inside her womb for 9 months, then breast fed from her!!?...What a hypocritic you are.
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How come you have no problem with accepting that Mary (the mother of your falsely claimed God) was 12 years old when she married Joseph who was 90 (ninety) years old then as stated by the Catholic Encyclopedia. Check here http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/08504a.htm
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How come you have no problem with the jews whose holiest book, the Talmud, states that: A girl must be 12 years old for marriage, but a 3-year old may be betrothed with the father's approval. As for the permissibility of marriage to a minor (katanah) by coition (Talmud) (the Code of Jewish Law)
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What a hypocritic you are.
by JESUS-IS-MUSLIM on June 1st, 2009
In the USA last century, the age of consent was 10 years old. (and in one state, Delaware, the age of consent was only seven). California was the first state to change the age of consent to 14, which it did in 1889. After California, other US states joined in and raised the age of consent too. (Source: http://www.ageofconsent.com/comments/numberone.htm)
http://womhist.binghamton.edu/teacher/aoc.htm
by JESUS-IS-MUSLIM on June 1st, 2009
Again, [Deuteronomy 33:1-2] combines references to Moses, Jesus and ??? (another PROPHET!).
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It speaks of God (i.e. God's revelation) coming from Sinai, rising from Seir (probably the village of Sa'ir near Jerusalem) and shining forth from Paran. According to Genesis 21:21, the wilderness of Paran was the place where Ishmael settled ( (i.e. Arabia, specifically Mecca (Makkah))!
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Indeed the King James Version of the Bible mentions the pilgrims passing through the valley of Ba'ca (another name for Mecca) in Psalms 84:4-6. Isaiah 42:1-13 speaks of the beloved of God. His elect and messenger who will bring down a law to be awaited in the isles and who "shall not fail nor be discouraged till he have set judgement on the earth." Verse 11 connects that awaited one with the descendants of Ke'dar. Who is Ke'dar? According to Genesis 25:13, Ke'dar was the second son of Ishmael, the ancestor of prophet Muhammad (pbuh).
by JESUS-IS-MUSLIM on June 1st, 2009
by Mephistopheles on October 28th, 2008
That one day, Iraq would be invaded and maybe even Iran
by LarryH54 on September 15th, 2008
There were many, from the destruction of the Temple in Jerusalem [in 70 AD] to future prophecies of His Return, coming down upon the Mount of Olives.
by Nanoo on October 29th, 2008
Yes in Islam Jesus is the best prophet being of no father.. Also that Mary was the best women..
jesus is not a phrophet..until you understand that you will never understand anything fully
by Happy-Dance on October 29th, 2008
Listen Cathy that is your opinion, not mine.. Telling someone you don't know, that they don't understand anything is what..very "Christian" of you ??? when Christian's and people of faith realise that they don't need to defend God then you might be able to sleep better at night...
by Nanoo on March 30th, 2009
I am very sick of people telling me what is "christian" behavior....Jesus himself, the most loving, forgiving man to ever walk the earth..blew his stack in the synagogue, yelling and throwing the goods that were being sold...IT IS CHRISTIAN FOR ME TO POINT OUT TRUTHS..and anyone that believes is free to believe..and anyone that disbelieves is free to disbelieve.. FREE CHOICE IS A GIFT FROM GOD....
by Happy-Dance on March 30th, 2009
Free choice from God you say!! if God game me the choice to choose any religion or point of view i like...who are you to criticize?? are you better than God??
by Nanoo on March 31st, 2009
by Bob on August 2nd, 2008
i'll refer readers to either the new testament or thomas jefferson's bible which consisted of only Jesus' statements ...
by Cs01kh on July 31st, 2008
I may have misunderstood the meaning of Phrophecy; and the following are according to Islam. these are not all of them and are not complete/detailed:
- speaking to the virgin Mary (to tell her that he is a born prophet/messenger) shortly after his birth
- speaking to the people that accused Mary of sinning when she returned to her people (to tell them that he is a prophet/messenger and that mary had not sinned)
- stating that there will be a birth of another prophet after himself that will reveal the final message (ahmed?)
- stating/knowing of his (jesus's) return to a small group of remaining people fighting for good (He requested from God to meet the people and God accepted).
According to islam, he knew (and was informed of) all of the above.
If you ask for sources, sorry, I am not good at finding them.
Also there should be more of his prophecies (that are not liked to Islam) but you will have to hope other people can give you examples (as my knowlege is very limited)
by Pete on June 1st, 2009
A prophet is one who can transmit ideas and change the world.
by Happy-Dance on May 31st, 2009
God knows all before it happens..and he knew the troubles that would face the middle east from the beginning..he knew the root of the problem before it existed..he knew of the fights between his chosen people and the muslims..this scripture is simply prophecy of the truth we are living today....and islam does teach hatred based on religious affiliation...take not the jews and christians for friends for they are friends to each other is just one of many examples that can be found in quran.
What is the prophet mohammed's flight in the quran called?
by Answerbag Staff on May 7th, 2011
| 1 person likes this
How can intelligent people seriously believe that the qu'ran is the untouched word of god and has not been
influenced by man?
by AnonymousSchmonimus on April 24th, 2011
| 6 people like this
Who is to blamed for the death of UN staff in Afghanistan over the burning of the Qur'an ?
by mike_70 on April 9th, 2011
| 1 person likes this
Is burning the Bible any different than burning the Qur'an?
by mike_70 on April 4th, 2011
| 2 people like this
Can anybody please tell me if Surah 27 has to be taken literally or not?
by Uzoma_M on May 2nd, 2011
| 1 person likes this
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Comments
Liz, you didn't read the Q, did you, it was about the prophecies of Jesus. Anyway, you've taken the opportunity to bring out another overlooked point. +5
by borasalama on September 16th, 2008
Liz it does not state another prophet would come out of Kedar, Tema or Medina. I do not see where you are deriving your logic. It mentions nothing of the sort. Isaiah 21:13-16 The oracle about Arabia
In the thickets of Arabia you must spend the night,
O caravans of Dedanites.
14Bring water for the thirsty,
O inhabitants of the land of Tema,
Meet the fugitive with bread.
15For they have fled from the swords,
From the drawn sword, and from the bent bow
And from the press of battle.
16For thus the Lord said to me, "In a year, as a hired man would count it, all the splendor of Kedar will terminate;
by no_one_special on September 26th, 2008
lol...thank you, i was having a bad day..really needed that laugh..muhammed in the bible....haaaaaa....jeeze you people will twist anything..hey by the way muslims believe the bible is corrupt..your own quran says so..so why would you point to a corrupt book and say muhammed is in it...lol..thanks alot..i mean really, i love it..
by Happy-Dance on October 28th, 2008
It's good to laugh, but it's also good to reflect a bit in your serious moments. Ask yourself if we're told that the Bible has correctly predicted all sorts of relatively minor events and personalities can it really have missed out on a person who is now followed by 1.4 billion people around the globe and who, according to Michael Hart, is the most influential person to have ever lived (http://www.dlmark.net/hundred.htm )? That being the case the Bible must be full of predictions about him. For example what about this from the OT http://www.answerbag.com/a_view/3517713 or this one from the NT http://www.answerbag.com/a_view/3674410 ?
by borasalama on October 29th, 2008
the bible speaks clearly of the comming christ...and calls him the prince of peace and emmanual (god with us)...not dude sent by god, not gods messenger, not realy well meaning guy who loves god..BUT GOD WITH US..this is the truth accept or not..you ca not change te truth
by Happy-Dance on October 29th, 2008
and it dd not miss out on muhammed..jesus warne dof false phrophet to come after him.....hey therefore the muslims are right..muhammed is in the bible..what a revelation!!!!!!..muhammed is one of the false prophets mentioned by Jesus...
by Happy-Dance on October 29th, 2008
I am the alpha and the omega.the beginning and the end..I come not to change the law but to fullfill it...beware of false prophets that will come in my name....Jesus is never wrong...
by Happy-Dance on October 29th, 2008
you can warp scripture all you want..but remember the quran itself says the jewish and christian scriptures have been distorted...lol then they point to the "corupt scripture" that muhammed told them was false to try to prove muhammed was a prophet.....oh m I am laughing again.....
by Happy-Dance on October 29th, 2008
see you cant beat me in a religious debate darling..because at one point i was considering conversion to islam, when i was catholic.(dont get me started on the catholic church)i had a very open mind..read quran cover to cover many times.had many volumes of hadith...and thank god for hadith, because reading that turned me into a born again christian.amen
by Happy-Dance on October 29th, 2008
One of the main points of AB is exchange of ideas. We can do that through discussion, but if that's not what you're here for that's fine by me. I will leave you with the greeting of Muslims and Jesus (Luke 24:36) salaam eleikom.
by borasalama on October 29th, 2008
PLEASE DONT GIVE ME JESUS' GREETINGS...MUSLIMS ALWAYS LIKE TO POINT OUT WHAT THEY FIND FALSE ABOUT THE BIBLE...BUT LOL WHEN WE SPEAK OF THE QURAN THEY RUN AND FLEE...
by Happy-Dance on October 29th, 2008
I don't flee from friendly discussion with mutual respect. Be scholarly and I might learn from you.
by borasalama on October 29th, 2008
@bora. The problem is friendly to you means acceptance and conversion. I have discussed matters with you. I have remained as respectful and patient as one can be yet you get angry and dodge questions. http://www.answerbag.com/a_view/1711356
by no_one_special on October 29th, 2008
i left my "discussion" with you when they became one sided, when you started distorting and misquoting my side of the discussion, when the discussion became a matter of arguing a point on principle.
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The purpose of a Muslim's discussion can be summarised as 'I'm not crazy, here's what I believe in and why, explain to me what you believe in and why'. The purpose is not conversion, in Islam conversion HAS to be driven from within a person not from without. Here's a video that testifies my point. You don't have to watch all of it. At about 6 min from the start the man who has of his own accord gone to a mosque to seek Islam is told 'I don't want you to become a Muslim yet' http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=N48Ymna9q8k A Chinese guy tried three times to accept Islam and every time he was sent back to learn more about it.
by borasalama on October 30th, 2008
mutual respect.....lol, no such thing in islam..you point out things you dont agree with in the corrupt books of the bible (muhammeds words) and you are having dialog..i do the sme about the quran and i am being disrespectful.....nope sorry..you will not silence me..
by Happy-Dance on October 30th, 2008
lol, and you forget who you are talking to..my husband gave me a peice of paper to sign at the eyptian consulate...i signed it thinking it would make it easier for me to travel..five minutes later someone came out gave me a gift of a head scarf and congratulated me on my "reversion" to Islam......how freakin funny is that...so please spare it for someone who hasnt live it..ignorance is bliss..leave me alone..you will never win with me.
by Happy-Dance on October 30th, 2008
MUTUAL respect means just that. It has to be reciprocal and equal. Some, repeat, some, Christians I have come across reserve ultra sensitivity exclusively for themselves and have a grossly off balance view of what is equal. They think along the lines of you insulted me by claiming that Allah and Mohammed are mentioned in my Bible so the least I can do is launch a disgraceful attack on Mohammed.
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If your story is as you tell it then I sympathise with you and your husband should be utterly ashamed of himself. His disgraceful behaviour does NOT change the HQ rule on conversions, no more than a thief's action changes the law on robberies.
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Your story is a living testimony of what I said - conversion has to be driven from within, otherwise it's meaningless. In fact in your case it's gone beyond being meaningless it's left you feeling justifiably hurt and unjustifiably hostile towards Islam.
by borasalama on October 30th, 2008
but i am still counted among the "fastest growing religion" in the world...and i am not the only one..similar stories are posted al the time on blogs i vist..i generally tell people to just giggle it away..you know what you are and so does god and nothing else matters..and yes i am hostile towards Islam..very..but not towards muslims..a fact that you can not wrap your mind around
by Happy-Dance on October 30th, 2008
hmmm, your latest comment might make some people giggle. It's like you're new to a place, you meet a smartly dressed guy who shows you around, but after he departs you discover he's conned you out of your cash and has walked away with your account details. However, you say the unfortunate experience has NOT left you suspicious of, or hating, smartly dressed people who introduce themselves to you in unfamiliar places but, QUITE STRANGELY, "VERY hostile towards" the law that such people are breaking by their behaviour, hmmm!?? Puzzling, "a fact that you can not wrap your mind around"? very much so don't you think?
by borasalama on October 31st, 2008
brainless babble of someone who wants to appear to be learned....my husband is but one muslim i know...maybe if you took the time to read my many many other post you would realize how stupid you sound...muslims are people..islam is the faith that is destroying their souls..the muslims need to be saved from islam....if you cant understand that maybe you you should take remedial english classes...many muslims, that god, are led to the christian faith..they are now saved...if we hate muslim how will we ever bring them to christ...and it happens all the time..i even have a broadcast that goes into the middle east via short wave radio..recieve mail from many muslim converts....amen
by Happy-Dance on October 31st, 2008
cat dear, Islam is the religion of Muslims. I wrap my mind around that very easily. You are the giggle on here. Best to keep you comments to yourself. Mmmm, remedial English, they didn't do much for your English (capital E). "..many muslims, that god, are led to the christian faith.." - this makes no sense. Islam is the fastest growing religion in the world. You want a reference (you do know what a reference is don't you, it's just that you have never used one), look up Wikipedia yourself. Catholicism is the largest but is dropping in numbers VERY fast. The pope calls it "the bleeding".
by Theby on October 31st, 2008
Isaiah prophesised the coming of Muhammad in the book of Isaiah chapter XXI13-16. Kedar is Arabia, Tema is Medina and Dedan is Mecca. Compare this ols Arabian map with a modern one. Tema is in the exact place as Medina and Dedan is in the exact place as Mecca. Muhammad migrated Mecca from persecution where the people of Tema greeted and welcomed him
by Theby on October 31st, 2008
Isaiah prophesised the coming of Muhammad in the book of Isaiah chapter XXI13-16. Kedar is Arabia, Tema is Medina and Dedan is Mecca. Compare this ols Arabian map with a modern one. Tema is in the exact place as Medina and Dedan is in the exact place as Mecca. Muhammad migrated Mecca from persecution where the people of Tema greeted and welcomed him
cat, you must have missed this when liz posted this. You made no comment. I copied it twice for your brain only. This is a good reference from you bible. Are you going to ignore this as well?
by Theby on October 31st, 2008
The question was what were Jesus's prophesies, not Isaiah's.
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Dumb.
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by Ecclesiastes on March 30th, 2009
the notion that islam is the fastest growing religion in the world is probably one of the biggest lies in the world right now...for two reasons..as muslims come to christ they are never deducted from the muslim count..they are still included as muslims..also..many people are counted as muslim that were never muslims, such as myself and my four children...we are counted as muslims becuase my ex registered us at the consulate as such...add to this the fact that all children born to a muslim man are counted as muslim..lol, I can not even tell you how many "muslim" children are not muslim..My own...the three that belong to my yemeni friend..the children of the two ex muslims converts that now regulary attend my church..and these are just the people that live with in a ten block radius of myself....the great lie that islam is the fastest growing religion in the world comes from islamic math....lol they never deduct and just keep adding..even those who are blatently not muslim..
by Happy-Dance on March 31st, 2009
Right now in America..more woman "convert" to islam for the purposes of getting married than any other reason..that is the reason why women convert to islam is much greater numbers than men...but alas, with the divorce rate of this particular group (american woman married to foreign muslim men) being at 73%, most if not all of those women go back to following their the faith they had before they were married..as well as raise their "muslim" children up in the church....these are christians, not muslims..however they are never deducted from the great muslim count..
There is no doubt that islam is a major world religion..however the steady growth, that is much slower than muslims will have you believe, is due to the very large birth rate of born muslims in muslim countries....I dare to say that 25% of people world wide that are counted as muslims, are in fact not muslims..
In Africa alone the conversion rate of people to the christian faith out numbers the people converting to islam by a
by Happy-Dance on March 31st, 2009
ratio of 3 to 1....this is due to the very large missionary population of this continent. Christians bring the word of God in love and peace..they show peole the great love of the christian God, by supplying bibles, education, schools, food, medicine and clean drinking water..muslims bring war and famine...everywhere in the world you find a large population of muslims, you find civil war, death, famine destruction..chopped off heads rolling through the street...remember East Timor...thank God the internation community stepped in there...now we can only hope they will do the same in the sudan where muslims are killing and slaughtering by the hundreds of thousands...in the name of allah
by Happy-Dance on March 31st, 2009
you can play word games all you want..you can say that christians also kill....and you would be right..christians do also kill...but when a christian kills he is breaking his religion..when a muslim kills he is obeying his religion...
by Happy-Dance on March 31st, 2009
cat, You're in denial. I have posted so much for you that you have obviously not even bothered to read. Crouch back into your own little delusion and block it all out, dear. Unsub
by Theby on March 31st, 2009
come on theby..it is very apparent that you are a convert..not a born muslim...you are the one in denial...but dont worry..I am sure that your muslim husband will not beat you too bad if you leave him before any children are born..but alas he is muslim..and muslims breed like animals and if you have been married for more than a week chances are you are pregnant..after all that is your only purpose as a muslim woman..to breed...which is why muslim men are allowed to have 4 wives..they can ave 4 woman pregnant every year instead of just one..lie back..open your legs and be a good muslims woman...some may say that is not a "christian" statement..I argue that any true statement is a christian statement
by Happy-Dance on March 31st, 2009
i find that working in a domestic violence shelter has given me far more insight into american women that convert to islam than you can ever possibly have..when they are married they defend islam with their last breath...mostly because they have to justify their "conversion"... to themselves and others..but as soon as they hit the shelter system..they cry..tell the truth..they take their children, and go back to the church..at least twice a week a woman comes in, most of the time with children, crying about the mistakes they made in marrying a muslim..they are told they can not bring their children to vist their own parents, because they have crosses in the house..They are controlled in every way..told how to dress, when they can leave the house, who they can have as friends..where they are allowed to work..when theycome they are fearful because they have been threated that their children would be taken out of the country..
by Happy-Dance on March 31st, 2009
we relocate most muslim victims of domestic violence to another state so their abusers can not find them and beat/kill or steal their children..it is really very easy to do..we simply call a DV shelter in another state and arranged for livings quarters there, then we put the families on a train/bus or plane...too bad the wife of the television station owner (muslim station) in upstate New York did not know about our services...she may not have stayed long enough to have her head chopped off..
by Happy-Dance on March 31st, 2009
Founder of Muslim TV network chops wife's head off
The founder of an American-Islamic television station has been arrested for beheading his wife.
Buffalo area police charged 44-year-old Muzzammil Hassan with second-degree murder.
Hassan is the founder and chief executive of Bridges TV (as in "building bridges," get it?). He launched the station in 2004, with the goal of improving the image of Muslims in the United States.
by Happy-Dance on March 31st, 2009
Catherine the GRATE. Yes, yes, yes. Your stories are amusing. We all have stories, dear. Christians go to shelters as well.
by Theby on June 1st, 2009
Catherine, I find your answers/comments VERY interesting to read. Go Girl is what I say, I see you have won ALL the debates, Well Done!!! also Catherine, what does it mean if muslims don't have ANY music in their house?
Theby, well your a different sty of pigs, I find you to be quite boring, rude, insecure, brainwashed and a coward, you aways run when you loose the arguement and can't face the debate. But your good to laugh at, in a big way that is Theby. Salmon
by Nrthn1 on June 2nd, 2009
oops lose not loose....beat ya to it theby
by Nrthn1 on June 2nd, 2009