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by Zebulon on February 5th, 2008

Zebulon

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Why do a lot of the same people who don't like Harry Potter for it's magic and sorcery believe in the stories of the bible, which have Jesus walking on water, people being brought back from the dead and water turning into wine? What is the difference?

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Answers. 21 helpful answers below.

  • by AntigoneRising on February 5th, 2008

    AntigoneRising

    The simple difference is that many people believe the Bible to be true, while everyone realizes that Harry Potter is a work of fiction. What baffles me is that the same people who protest Harry Potter seem to overlook the Wizard of Oz, Cinderella, Snow White, and just about every other children's story about magic.

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  • by darthson decries derigible destruction on February 5th, 2008

    darthson decries derigible destruction

    For a lot of those people, they take very seriously the warnings of the Bible to stay away from sorcery. They believe even fiction about such things is dangerous. As a conservative Christian, I disagree- the Harry Potter books, as far as I've read them, are quite enjoyable! (I've only gotten through book five- just trying to stay ahead of the movies.)

    On the other hand, the Bible doesn't talk about "magic" in the conventional sense- there is no "hocus pocus" for example. You bring the example of Jesus- who isn't just a man, but is God, as he is presented in the Bible. He's not calling up spirits to do the work for him.

    Now, this discussion could get very deep depending the type of magic you're talking about; but as far as Harry Potter goes, it's simply them taking very seriosuly the warnings from the Bible. Nothing more than that.

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  • by Live to Ride on April 5th, 2008

    Live to Ride

    A better question would be why do some Christians hate 'Harry Potter' but LOVE 'Lord of the Rings'?!

    I AM a Christian and even I can't answer this one...?!

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  • by iwnit on October 16th, 2008

    iwnit

    1) "Magia was viewed with suspicion by Christianity from the time of the Church fathers. It was, however, never completely settled whether there may be permissible practicies, e.g. involving relics or holy water as opposed to blasphemous necromancy (nigromantia) involving the invocation of demons (goetia). The distinction became particularly pointed and controversial during the Early Modern witch-hunts, with some learned authors such as Johannes Hartlieb denouncing all magical practice as blasphemous, while others portrayed natural magic as not sinful. The position taken by Heinrich Cornelius Agrippa, one of the foremost Renaissance magicians, is notoriously ambiguous. The character of Faustus, likely based on a historical 16th century magician or charlatan, became the prototypical popular tale of a learned magician who succumbs to blasphemy (pact with the devil).
    The current Catechism of the Catholic Church discusses divination and magic under the heading of the First Commandment.[21] It is careful to allow for the possibility of divinely inspired prophecy, but rejects "all forms of divination":
    (2116) All forms of divination are to be rejected: recourse to Satan or demons, conjuring up the dead or other practices falsely supposed to "unveil" the future. Consulting horoscopes, astrology, palm reading, interpretation of omens and lots, the phenomena of clairvoyance, and recourse to mediums all conceal a desire for power over time, history, and, in the last analysis, other human beings, as well as a wish to conciliate hidden powers. They contradict the honor, respect, and loving fear that we owe to God alone.
    The section on "practices of magic or sorcery" is less absolute, specifying "attempts to tame occult powers" in order to "have supernatural power over others". Such are denounced as "gravely contrary to the virtue of religion", notably avoiding a statement on whether such attempts can have any actual effect (that is, attempts to employ occult practices are identified as violating the First Commandment because they in themselves betray a lack of faith, and not because they may or may not result in the desired effect)."
    Source and further information:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magic_(paranormal%29#In_Christianity


    2) "The descriptions of most miracles in the Christian New Testament are often the same as the commonplace definition of the word: God intervenes in the laws of nature. In St John's Gospel the miracles are referred to as "signs" and the emphasis is on God demonstrating his underlying normal activity in remarkable ways.[3]
    Jesus is recorded as having turned water into wine; creating matter out of nothing, and thus turning a loaf of bread into many loaves of bread; and raising the dead. Jesus is also described as rising from the dead himself, God his father having raised him. Jesus explains in the New Testament that miracles are performed by faith in God. "If you have faith as small as a mustard seed, you can say to this mountain, “move from here to there” and it will move." (Gospel of Matthew 17:20). After Jesus returned to heaven, the book of Acts records the disciples of Jesus praying to God to grant that miracles be done in his name, for the purpose of convincing onlookers that he is alive. (Acts 4:29-31). Other passages mention performing miracles as an identifying feature of a False prophet(Matthew 24:24, 2 Thes 2:9, Revelation 13:13)"
    Source and further information:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miracle#In_the_New_Testament


    3) "One of the foremost characteristics of Hellenistic magic was the recitation of ritualistic formulae. "

    "The Greek Magical Papyri contain many performative rituals including the use of incantations, potions, herbs, charms, and amulets. "

    "Another instructive illustration is the way a knowledge of the names of the god/daimon provides the magician with power over that god/daimon. For instance in PGM I.195-222, the conjurer is told that he can command Helios to "shield me against all excess of magical power of aerial daimon [and] fate. Aye, lord, because I call upon your secret name." Thus the papyri indicate--implicitly, if not always explicitly--that esoteric knowledge is often crucial to effective exorcism.

    Repetition is also a key element in these ancient spells. Since power over the god/daimon resides in a knowledge of and use of the secret name, the incantations in the Greek Magical Papyri instruct the conjurer to repeat that secret name over and over. The magician is also instructed to repeat the entire spell a number of times. For example, PGM VII.505-28 tells the practitioner to perform this ritual fourteen times: at sunset and sunrise over a seven-day period.

    Miracle in the Lucan corpus contains none of these characteristics--well, perhaps one. Luke-Acts does reveal that Jesus wanted to know the name of a demon (Luke 8:30), although Luke does not tell us that Jesus required or used that name to control the demon. Neither does the context seem to imply the name was literal, it could just as well have been figurative. Later Jesus' followers effected miracles by using the name of Jesus-and nothing else (Luke 10:17; Acts 4:7; 4:30). Still later, non-believers tried to incorporate Jesus' name into a spell (Acts 19:13-17), but to their own dismay and injury. Thus the power of the name of Jesus was not quite the same as the (supposed) power of knowing and using a demon's name. The power of Jesus' name resided in more than knowing and saying it, regardless of how often it was repeated.

    Just as interesting, a demon's knowledge of Jesus' identity and name gave it no power over Jesus. /29/ For instance in Luke 8:28, when the demon possessed man saw Jesus,

    he cried out and fell at his feet, shouting at the top of his voice, "What do you want with me, Jesus, Son of the Most High God? I beg you, don't torture me!" For Jesus had commanded the evil spirit to come out of the man.

    Though he (the demon) knew Jesus' name, he had no power over Jesus but fully recognized Jesus' authority and power over him.

    To summarize, in magic, the knowledge of the name of a demon gave a person power over it. In New Testament Christianity an experiential knowledge of Jesus allowed one to use the power of his name over demons--but not over Jesus.

    Perhaps this topic can be concluded with one last question: How many of the Lucan accounts show Jesus or the Apostles as requiring the name of a demon in order to cast it out? None. On the other hand, his followers only had to know and use the authority and power of the name of Jesus to control demons (Luke 9:49, 10:17; Acts 16:18)."
    Source and further information:
    http://steve-badger.net/magic/mirmag.html

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  • by Langenschwert on October 11th, 2008

    Langenschwert

    Simple answer: Because they're dumb.

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  • by Nathan Explosion on February 5th, 2008

    Nathan Explosion

    Maybe they consider it competition...

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  • by Caffenated llama of flourescent doom on February 5th, 2008

    Caffenated llama of flourescent doom

    Oh, there is totally a difference, see, if Harry Potter does it its magic, and thus evil, but, if Jesus Christ does it, its a miracle, which has absolutely nothing to do with magic.
    There is also the fact that most people who protest the books for their "saanic" message haven't even considered the possibility of maybe reading it, and thus spread rumours about how they summon demons and use tarot cards and wegie boards.

    http://www.chick.com/reading/tracts/5012/5012_01.asp

    This is good if you want a laugh, its an anti- Harry Potter tract. You can thell they've totally read the book.

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  • by Freddy Says remove all moderation points on February 5th, 2008

    Freddy Says remove all moderation points

    "My mythology is better than your mythology" and the best way for me to fight yours is to have it abolished or declared to be blasphemy.

    Priesthoods have always suppressed free speech by the masses. In England The Bible was a *banned book* to ensure that the version translated in to English was unavailable to the populace who might actually interpret it!

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  • by LadyAguja on July 23rd, 2009

    LadyAguja

    I have pondered your same question many times. I think that some Christians see their faith as a difficult path to follow, like balancing on a tightrope, and you have to just put one foot ahead of the other without straying, or else you will fall into the pit. In other words, you have to just do what the Bible says, and not question it too much, or allow yourself to have other thoughts or fantasies, or else you'll fall into a trap of temptation. Note that I'm talking about SOME Christians here, not all. So they think that books like Harry Potter promote children (whose minds are easily swayed) to think about all sorts of magical things, a lot of which is fiction, and then they will get confused about the magical stories in the Bible (which most Christians believe to be non-fiction) and thereby fall from the track of blind acceptance of everything that's in the Bible, start having doubts, and leave the religion altogether.

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  • by Tom Terrific on March 13th, 2009

    Tom Terrific

    I believe those Christians who are incensed over HP take the view that supernatural power has only two possible sources: God, and the devil. In their view, any "magic" must come from one or the other.

    The power presented in HP is a "neutral" supernatural power, which can be used for "good" or "evil"; therefore, it cannot be from God, and thus it must be from the devil.

    The power claimed by modern-day Witches falls under the same category, by the same analysis; and so, these Christians argue that presenting demonic power under the guise of an interesting children's story is like selling cigarette lighters bearing the images of cartoon characters: softening up kids for corruption by the devil.

    There are passages in the Bible against the sorts of things associated with magic, e.g. divination and consulting spirits; and there is a story in the New Testament book of Acts where upon hearing the gospel many people came and burned their "books of magic."

    I'm no authority, but I find it best to simply leave the Christians alone on this issue. They seem to have clear guidance from their own spiritual advisors against "magic," so, as long as they leave the rest of society alone, and don't try to make the rest of us live by their rules, let them believe what they want.

    As for the reason that most of them don't have problems with Tolkien and Lewis - both Christians, and both authors of books with magic in them - is that they would eventually come against them, as well. Easy targets first. Same reason they don't rail against the Hindus, but do rail against the Witches - despite the fact that the two religions have very similar theologies. There are lots of Hindus, and they've been around awhile; but Witches ... :) Of course, it must be admitted, the word "witch" appears in their scriptures, and so is a hot button.

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  • by Don Gorgeous George on October 15th, 2008

    Don Gorgeous George

    News flash people, prayer is sorcery. Yep it's true. If you pray, even for good unselfish things, you are practicing sorcery. If your prayer heals a sick person who you do not even know, you have practiced sorcery. In the bible sorcery is strictly forbidden because it can be used for many things, and they did not want any competition. The writers of the bible were powerful sorcerers and purposely went out of their way to make sure that most people would remain blind to the real powers of sorcery. They did this by removing the knowledge of sorcery and by forbidding its practice. This makes the people easier to manipulate and control. Many of the ancient texts that were burned by christians over the last couple thousand years were in fact, sorcery text books. You can see why they wanted this stuff removed from the public, they even wrote about it in the bible. Do you think that if it wasn't a threat to their plan, they would have cared enough to go out of their way to destroy the knowledge? Of course not! No one is protected from sorcery just because they believe in God. God is a front man, an excuse to not protect yourselves. It takes the responsibility away from the individual and prevents true spiritual growth and knowledge of self. Every single person on this earth, and all who have ever lived were sorcerers or are sorcerers, including Jesus "Christ".

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  • by MrWitch on February 5th, 2008

    MrWitch

    Mainly, the difference is belief. Bible believers must surely outnumber Potter believers by hundreds of millions to one. One is real to many, the other is not.

    Now I'm not giving my own beliefs - but many will quote the Bible and it's prohibitions against 'sorcery' or 'magic' that doesn't come from God. I find God, especially in the OT, to be very possessive and jealous about 'his rights' - specifically to be worshipped appropriately without question. Basically, the Bible seems to say, fail in this and you're damned. You can murder, rape, pillage, and cheat in school tests, but worship more than one God, or the wrong one, and you're toast.

    Funny thing is, how do we define 'magic'? Wouldn't a match be magic if it's use is shown to a person who is primitive enough? What would OT writers living in 1000 BC think of computers, or TV, or atomic power?

    Best thing to do is let the people who want to rant and froth about a fictional character get on with it. I've no doubt it makes them happy, and all the religious chatter is fairly harmless stuff. I draw the line when someone tells others they're going to Hell because they watched a film or read a book though. No-one has been able to pursuade me that that sort of accusation is anything but spiteful.

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  • by Azraff on February 5th, 2008

    Azraff

    Excellent point. There is also the Kabalah, a Jewish
    system of mysticism.

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  • by jennyb on February 5th, 2008

    jennyb

    Some people hold more strongly in their sacrosanct beliefs when it comes to religion. Once any other being(harry potter) may put forward that type of power, it is not longer sacred anymore. I think in my opinion, it more of a religious pride type thing. Also, many religions believe this to be "dark" and "evil" however, so is sacrifying your own children so who is to say...

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  • by Simon on April 6th, 2008

    Simon

    Who does Jesus give the credit to?

    This is the difference.

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  • by gazzob666 on February 5th, 2008

    gazzob666

    haha if only u knew. but hey i lik fantasy books lik harry potter. i recommend reading books by the author raymond e feist.

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  • by Simon on April 7th, 2008

    Simon

    Miracles and magic are not the same.

    Magic is powerful in a way, in that it appears to be superhuman acts done by an individual. (keep in mind that Harry Potter is not real) There are magicians sorcerers etc... in real life though. Most people are basic magicians. If you can tell a story to another which is not the truth and they belive it, that is magic, although it's a lie, you have magically convined them of a non-reality. Such as, I did this, and accomplished that, and was superior in this situation, or that one, when you were not. Thats magic.
    Even "streaching the truth is magic." Magic profits nothing, except, inflation of a false sense of self.

    When A miracle happens it benificial for healing, not entertainment. Although many even in Jesus' day would follow him around to be entertained, but that was not his concern, he took no credit, and to those who did not care about the phenomena of Jesus' actions, but genuine help from a qualified representive of Gods majesty, They recieved spiritual healing.

    Miracles banish ignorance, while magic blackets the truth for entertainment.

    A simple miracle you could perform would be to not boast of the past, or descibe what you will do in the future. Not tell magical stories, but be fully present. Yes you might become less entertaining to others, but you will be accomplishing somthing far greater then magic.

    You will begin to be healed of delusion, and because the cause of your actions are selfless, the effect will not be future suffering.

    God Bless

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  • by andijo on March 13th, 2009

    andijo

    i think there is a clear line between magic and the power of God. and i also think for the "religious" people that say they dont like it because of the magic get a grip as long as we are teaching our children right and the Godly way lets foucus on a more serious topic. i mean this is why a lot of non believers think us believers are foolish and full of non-sense killing innicent children. And praying sin up and down our nations streets thats what we need to be foucusing on not a childrens movie.

    I hope this answers your question.

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  • by Twisted Taco on March 13th, 2009

    Twisted Taco

    Because if Harry and Jesus had a fight, Harry could probably beat the diapers off Jesus

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  • by angelzz on April 28th, 2008

    angelzz

    biblical stories are miracles not witchcraft "things". ok i dint mean to offend anybody by that. its just that
    witchcraft was always considered to be the :dark: side. biblical stories teach morals and are more of miracles not "hocus pocus." i disagree with harry potter b/c of the more :symbolism: in it. i went online and did research and was astonished to find the hidden little messages in it. everybody just chooses wut they believe

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  • by Simon on April 8th, 2008

    Simon

    We are not in an ancient culture now, and the translation of ancient cultures beliefs, I think would be fair to say tainted.

    If you and I went to the forest to live out the next 30 years in silence. Yes I'm sure we would experience amazing events and not call them a miracle or magic. Miracle and magic is what it is called, not what it is.

    I am not aguring what you are saying, and I hope you enjoy this interaction, I know I do.

    Heres another way to explain to worship demigods, and spiritual phenomena is a way to approach worship, or in others words a area where you can direct your attention. However these objects are not the Supreme and, but are parts. So while worshipping demigods you shall reach demigods.

    But God is the Infinate, Supreme and the only object of all worship. Falling short of the Infinate Christ, ones worship lesser beings. Lesser powers, although He allows free will to call on demigods He is the Supersoul in the soul of the demi gods, and in the soul of all living and non-living entities.

    I am open to look into other ways of thinking and I have looked into many different religions and spiritual paths with an open mind. But I find that meditating on the infinate with the mind expanding passed all limitations of objects, and definition brings the most expansive state of being, or intense awreness of what is.

    Peace

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