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by The Chief on January 19th, 2010
Selected by the asker, Cognition aka Cog. (What's this?)
Hmmmmmm...
At the risk of thoroughly p*ssing off some people here (on both sides of the fence), this is NOT as simple as it may seem at first glance.
First of all, there are several "pit bull" type breeds. American Pit Bull Terrier, American Staffordshire Terrier, and Staffordshire Terrier, to name a few.
And there are other closely related breeds, as well.
The term "pit bull" derives from the purpose of the breed, in general...a dog bred to fight, usually other dogs, in a "pit", or type of arena for animal fighting.
To that end, intelligence, speed, strength, and agressiveness are desirable characteristics because the dog is meant as a fighting breed.
Now, that said, a dog is (like humans) a product of it's natural instincts AND how it is raised. Which means, as in humans, the final outcome is very much influenced by it's upbringing.
However, one must bear in mind that not every breed of dog is suitable for every environment. And not every dog within a breed will have identical personality traits, either.
You want a family dog? There are logs to choose from, with respect to breeds and their characteristics. However, some are better suited for family dogs than others.
Got small children? Chow dogs may not be the best due to their temperament.
Got other dogs? Some breeds may not integrate as well with others because of the instinctive traits they are bred to have dominant. Owners who do not understands these traits will not know how to integrate them and how to work with their behaviors. A St. Bernard, for example, may have overriding stubornness and dominance issues with other dogs. Humans, too, for that matter.
And personally, I absolutely HATE "yippy-dogs"...small dogs who seem to have a brain just large enough to start barking, but not quite large enough to shut the f*ck up. Some people like 'em...but not me.
One must pick and choose both the breed AND the dog with care, whatever one gets. And one must also train the pup/dog as well, understanding both his breed traits and his individual personality traits.
Are Pit Bulls aggressive? Certainly. They were bred for that characteristic. But "aggressive" does not translate directly into "violent", necessarily.
by bagicide stayed 10 months too long on January 22nd, 2010
Selected by the asker, Cognition aka Cog. (What's this?)
Sorry Cog, I crafted the answer before I saw you were the questioner. However, I put a lot of effort into crafting the answer and I think it has merit. Please understand that this is not directed personally at you, but at the question and at those who consistently deny that there is a danger to these dogs.
Okay, lets be honest here. Pit bulls have been bred for fighting for a very long time. Two dogs are put into a pit and allowed to fight to the death. The one that lives gets to have puppies, and the one that dies doesn't. Now, it is pretty hard to get two dogs to fight to the death. I mean, you can try to force them, but what are you going to do if they don't? Kill them? Dogs normally fight to enforce a pecking order or to win fair female. They don't normally fight to kill. So you'd have to put in some pretty serious genetic manipulation to even get a dog willing to go there in the first place, and then you'd have to keep choosing the survivors of that brutal manipulation. So do you really think they are going to be the passivists of the dog world?
If you believe they are really sweet little dogs that just love babies and trip lightly through the flowers, then you have to believe that manipulating genes by selection doesn't work. Oops, bye bye Darwin and all of the science built upon him. And no, I'm not talking about natural selection here, I do know the difference. But if you can't change the makeup of an animal by artificially selecting for a certain trait, then it ain't happening naturally either. You'd have to believe that there is no such thing as race horses, or dairy cows, or white chickens either.
Now, I'm not saying that you should go and kill all of the Pit bulls in all the shelters all across the country, but I do think its time we stop breeding them. These are not family pets. I do think that if you have others living in your house, or maybe within a mile of you, you shouldn't adopt a pit bull. If you want to commit suicide that is your business. I mean really, when was the last time you heard of an elderly person being mauled to death by a Border Collie while trying to defend her grandchildren from it? You have a responsibility to your family and to your neighbors to not bring a naturally vicious dog into their midst just the same as you have a responsibility not to bring hand grenade into their midst. Yes, if you raise one carefully, you can get a dog that seems happy and well-behaved. But I would argue that it is like keeping a lion for a house pet, or a chimp: they can seem well trained and well-adjusted, but that predator instinct is just below the surface, waiting for someone to run or shriek or move to quickly and the next thing you know that instinct to kill is triggered.
I'm sure I'm going to get landed on and bashed by all sorts of animal lovers and PETA supporters for this answer, but I'm tired of being PC and the loss of being honest. I've been bitten by a German Shepherd and I've narrowly escaped being bitten by a Rottie. I watched my stepfather beat two Dobermans off my mother when she slipped an fell on a public hiking trail (thank God he had a walking stick). Those breeds were all bred by the Nazis to hunt humans, and the instinct hasn't been totally bred out of them, even after many generations. You aren't going to train that out of a Pit Bull in one generation.
by Millenium - The Mysterious M. . . GONE! on January 19th, 2010
I don't believe ANY dog is born into this world BAD; unless they're "brain damaged"! It's the damned HUMANS that make them that way!
by weedman1991 on January 19th, 2010
No it is the people that dont know how to take care of the dogs
by Anonymous on November 4th, 2010
They may or may not be more aggressive, but an aggressive pit bull is deadly and everyone knows that any dog can turn.
by Brady on February 22nd, 2010
Any vicious kind of dog like pitbulls will become vicious if their owners don't socialize them with people when they are puppies. The book "Your Purebred Puppy" says to socialize these kinds of dogs.
Another book called "The Simon and Schuster's Guide to Dogs" says the American Staffordshire Terrier (a pitbull dog) can become a tranquil dog that can tell between the good and bad intentions of a stranger if they are given a little training.
by Allie79 on February 11th, 2010
Pitbulls can be agressive if you train them to be. But if you give it love and care just like any other pet, it will be loveable and friendly =]
by slim2316 on February 5th, 2010
Pitbulls are not meant for every one.
by slim2316 on February 5th, 2010
I am a 22yr. Old American Irish, and may not have much experience,But I am very experienced with Pitbulls.The Pitbull breed has been my families choice in dogs for as far back as my family tree can be traced.My ancestor raised,and bred them to fight,in Ireland,My great Grand fathers transported them to this country,and fought them here.My Grand fathers used them as watch dogs,and protection dogs.My father had fought the breed when he was young,and as he got older,he used them as house dogs.I have carried my family's tradition,however;I do not fight my dogs,mine are house dogs.
With that being said,the Pitbull was Bred as a fighting dog,and has been used for that purpose for many,many years. The Pitbull is a naturally agressive dog for that reason.They are more likely to be violent than most breeds.
The Pitbull is a special breed,but to bring out the best in them,you MUST understand the breed.
I do not suggest attempting to own a Pitbull unless you know how to train a PITBULL. You may have trained dogs in the past,but training a Pitbull is a bit different.They are more defiant,especially red nosed Pits.They respond to a slap on the ass,or a whack with a news paper,in violence,it is in their blood.
A Pitbull has to respect you,NOT fear you.A Pitbull in fear,will eventually lash out.
If you do own a Pitbull and train it properly,they are incredible dogs. The dog of all dogs,in my opinion. Beautiful,energetic,loyal,protective,loving,and they will even comfort loved ones in stressed situations.
They can be great with kids,and other dogs,but will answer to only one master,if properly trained.
Simply put the Pitbull is not meant for every one.
by baa_baa_blacksheep on January 22nd, 2010
dogs can be bred to be more dominant hence why you should look for a good breeder. Pit bulls (whether it is an APBT or like breed) are not evil. They can be very sweet in the right hands.
by Wellduh on January 19th, 2010
Both in a way. They are a good breed of dog and if trained properly they are wonderful pets. They are aggressive though. I have been bitten by little dogs at my job but never by a big "bad rep" dog. Any dog will bite under certain circumstances.
by helpfulanswers on November 4th, 2010
i know old fearful grannies that like to be afriad of and shriek at things without investigating the claim sbeing presented to them, unfortunately , hate pit bulls having never ever seen one in their entire life
the bad rap is because people like to RAP badly , and create hysteria, instead of finding solutions, i don't ean to single out the grannies but they seem to be th emost ysterical about issues that aren't so bad ,
so yes they have, dangerous dog = pitbull ( conditoined response ) , that shows you people are not thinking, they are being told what to thin, if you say dangerous dog i don't think poodle comes to mind, but poodles can be more mean than pitbulls, just they are tiny .
i don't know if apitbull in itself is an aggressive dog they might be but surely only if they are not socialized properly , because a german shepherd is usually an attack dog but a lot of them are goofy and friendly ?
who here knows pit bulls and hangs out with them to answer this question ?
"Now, I'm not saying that you should go and kill all of the Pit bulls in all the shelters all across the country, but I do think its time we stop breeding them. These are not family pets. I do think that if you have others living in your house, or maybe within a mile of you, you shouldn't adopt a pit bull. If you want to commit suicide that is your business. I mean really, when was the last time you heard of an elderly person being mauled to death by a Border Collie while trying to defend her grandchildren from it? You have a responsibility to your family and to your neighbors to not bring a naturally vicious dog into their midst just the same as you have a responsibility not to bring hand grenade into their midst. Yes, if you raise one carefully, you can get a dog that seems happy and well-behaved. But I would argue that it is like keeping a lion for a house pet, or a chimp: they can seem well trained and well-adjusted, but that predator instinct is just below the surface, waiting for someone to run or shriek or move to quickly and the next thing you know that instinct to kill is triggered.
Read more: Do you think Pit Bulls have been given a bad rap or are they inherently aggressive? | Answerbag http://www.answerbag.com/q_view/1891213#ans9848487#ixzz14MogO68B"
are you going a bit overboard, these dogs , are you saying that they are raised with love their whole lives and they decide to go kill babies and grandmothers ? i think that angry people raise pitbulls , and angrily raised pitbulls that get loose cause problems ? will you elaboarte on this question ?
comparing a pitbull to a lion is wierd because any dog will adopt the traits of its owners based upon how they interact with it , and , my socipathic psychotic evil attack poodles ( my grandmothers anyway ) do not chase you and BITE YOU an dHATE YOU and want you dead, when the grandparents are not home but as soon as they get there because the grandmother is wreaked iwth a lie of stress and freaking out and yelling about things that aren't actually dangerous but she thinks they are, well, th epoodles take her fear and go try to kill you but they are like 3 inches tall and can't even really properly bite you ,
when she is NOT in the house at all, those dogs, you can , basically do stuff around them, but , if they were a pitbull they'd kill you for sure , because you can't even walk into the room withotu being attacked an dbitten, swee hwat i mean ? that is not LIKE a poddole, its like a horirble shrieking grandmother that really , i have no idea why she is that way , because she somethow belives that just about everything is something to get incrediblyd stressed out about, like someone missing a turn obviously means OH MY GOD HIS MEMORY IS BAD .
by Daze on November 4th, 2010
I do think they have gotten a bad wrap,,because of their owners. Any dog can be just as aggressive if treated that way...pitbulls were only chosen because of their strength and power. And yes some blood lines have been tainted with this disgusting act of dog fighting...but not ALL breeders do this. There are more and more ppl trying to help this poor breed. Cause they know what wonderful dogs they are :)
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Comments
Outstanding answer with great information for others who are considering a family pet. Like you, I would caution them to remember the natural instinct of the breed first and formost.
by Cognition aka Cog on January 20th, 2010
Thank you, Cog!
by The Chief on January 20th, 2010
the American Staffordshire terrier,is not "a pitbull type breed",American Staffordshire terrier is the exact same breed,it is just a sugar coated way to say Pitbull.
And a Pitbull can be an excellent family dog,in the right hands.
When i say "right hands" I dont just mean a good home that loves and takes good care of their pets either.
You need a serious understanding of the breed,if you know what your doing,you can train a Pitbull to be any kind of pet.
My Irish Red Nose,Joker,comes from a long line of champion fighters,hes now 5 yrs. old and never hurt a fly.
My cousin is blind,His dog is from the same litter as my Joker,and his serves as a seeing eye dog.
You just have to know how the breed is wired,and you can change it,but it has to start while they are pups.
by slim2316 on February 5th, 2010
Knowing the breed was part of my point.
As for the American Staffordshire Terrier not being "a pitbull type breed", I beg to differ.
http://www.bulldogbreeds.com/americanstaffordshireterrier.html
Many people rush out to get a particular breed for faddish reasons...like Dalmations when the movie 101 Dalmations was redone and released several years ago. Yet, few of those people had even the most basic understanding of the temperment and requirements of that breed...and thus many ended up giving up their dogs, putting them down, or simply raising them in an abusive environment because THEY didn't understand the characteristics and requirements of the Dalmation breed.
And that's every bit as sad as people who do the same with ANY dog breed, pit bulls included.
by The Chief on February 5th, 2010
"The American Staffordshire Terrier's muscled build and protective instinct should make strangers beware, yet with their own family they are devoted, gentle and loving. A common question regarding the American Staffordshire Terrier is, "How is this breed different from the American Pit Bull Terrier?". In the eyes of the United Kennel Club, they are the same breed, but many disagree. Some AKC-registered American Staffordshire Terriers are dual-registered as American Pit Bull Terriers with the UKC; however, this draws criticism from many who point out that the bloodlines have been separate for too long for these to be considered the same breed. The AKC, on the other hand, does not allow a UKC-registered American Pit Bull Terrier to be registered as an American Staffordshire Terrier. To be dual-registered, the dog must first be an AKC-registered American Staffordshire Terrier and then it can be registered with the UKC as an APBT -- but not vice versa... They are courageous and a tenacious fighter if provoked. Training can be a challenge because of their pushy yet sensitive character. Their natural temperament towards people is gentle and loving, unfortunately some have been improperly handled giving the American Staffordshire Terrier a bad rap."
I looked at your reference,it does not say one way or the other.It only shows two opinions. The idea that the A.S.S.T. is a seperate breed than the A.P.B.T. is based on kennel club politics. Please read my answer,you will understand that I am not just talking out of my ass,I am not using references,I am using the knowledge that has been passed through my family since the early years of Pitbulls.
I challenge you to look for other references,and other literature on the topic. By the way I meant no insult in my original comment,this one either,I am just passionate about Pitbulls and setting the record straight.
I do not own Pitbulls for "faddish reasons" it is a family tradition,my family has worked with the breed for years,and used them for countless purposes.If you are at all interested you really should take the time to read my answer.
by slim2316 on February 5th, 2010
I never said YOU owned any breed as a result of a fad, much less Pitbulls, my friend. Read my own comment!
:):)
Since you put it up there for me to look for other references:
http://www.dogbreedinfo.com/americanstaffordshire.htm
"Classed by AKC as American Staffordshire Terrier" and by UKC as "American Pitbull Terrier."" though the next sentence is: "The American Staffordshire Terrier, age generally of larger bone structure, head size and weight then their cousins the American Pitbull Terrier."
http://www.workingpitbull.com/amstaffpit.htm
"Dog fanciers developed "standards of perfection" for breeds, and subdivided types of dogs into more and more separate breeds. The vast majority of pit bull breeders fought to keep their dogs away from the show ring, and succeeded for several decades. Then, like now, breeder of true performance dogs knew that the show ring spelled ruination for their animals. It wasn't until the 1930's that a very small group of individuals made an attempt to bring the pit bull into the show dog world."
"Using several dogs (including Colby's Primo) as the "standard of perfection", a physical standard was drawn up for the pit bull. The name "pit bull" was a problem for these show dog folks - they felt it would scare people off. They tried several names, including Yankee Terrier which was a foolish choice for a bulldog from the United Kingdom! They finally settled on "Staffordshire Terrier". To this day, the debate about whether or not the pit bull should be grouped with terriers (small dogs which go into tunnels for vermin) rages."
"At the turn of the last century, the American Dog Breeders Association and the United Kennel Club were already registering pit bulls. When the American Kennel Club accepted the pit bull into their stud books in 1936, UKC and ADBA registered pit bulls got their registered names changed to "Staffordshire Terriers. To add to the confusion, the name "Staffordshire Terrier" was changed to "American Staffordshire Terrier" in the 1970's when the AKC decided that the pit bulls still being bred in England had enough variation in type to warrant being called a different "breed"."
"So, while the dogs all originated from the same group of animals from the United Kingdom, the dog show world turned them into three different "breeds". The American pit bull terrier, the American Staffordshire terrier and the Staffordshire bull terrier."
"Are they the same breed? Read on!"
"There is no right or wrong answer to this question. It is all a matter of perspective."
"Perspective 1) all dogs, AKC, UKC or ADBA all originated from the same group of British dogs, making American Staffs, Staffie bulls and American pit bulls all the same dog."
"Perspective 2) when the original British dogs came over, they became American Staffs and American pit bulls, however, the dogs which remained in Britain are somehow significantly different from the American dogs."
"Perspective 3) all three of the "breeds" originated from the same group of British dogs, but have been bred along different lines and for different purposed long enough now to be separate breeds."
by The Chief on February 5th, 2010
Perhaps the last link is the most infomative on this issue. Be that as it may.
Let me say this:
I accept your stand on Pitbulls. I accept that you have had experience with the breed for years. I accept that your practical experience eclipses my "book" knowledge of the breed. And I accept that you meant no insult.
But most importantly, I acknowledge that we BOTH have the same overall goal with respect to Pitbull ownership...ANY dog ownership, for that matter: ANYBODY who wishes to own a dog should be a RESPONSIBLE owner, regardless of the breed and regardless of the individual disposition of the particular dog.
I have owned three dogs in my life, none of which were Pitbulls. One a Cocker Spaniel/Dachshund, another a German Sheperd/Collie/Lab mix, and the last a Black Lab. None of my brothers and sister (all of whom have had several dogs as part of their families) owned a Pitbull either. Some purebred, some mutts, but it's been quite a spread. Every one of us had to take into consideration not just the individual dog's personality, but the characteristics of the breed(s) involved as well when raising and training the dog.
I would expect no less of anyone who would own a Pitbull.
by The Chief on February 5th, 2010
I appreciate that when you posted your references,you posted some that supported my argument as well.
Most would have only showed the research that benefits their own point of view.
by slim2316 on February 5th, 2010
I try to be as open minded as I can. I learn a lot here on AB as well...and I'm ALWAYS glad about it. And if I'm flat out wrong...well, that happens too.
:):):)
by The Chief on February 5th, 2010