I often hear people say that "God hates the sin but loves the sinner". This doesn't seem to be supported by the Bible, so where does the saying come from?

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• Assuming the bible is true, then god knew we would sin when he created the fruit of knowledge. Seems kind of a dick move to set us up to fail and then be "forgiving" about it.

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  by ConservativelyLiberal on November 14th, 2009

• Im sorry you feel that way.
  
  God is all powerful and he does know everything. It was not such a "move" as you say. He gave man a mind of his own, to make his own decisions. God knew what man would decide to do, and it hurt him deeply.
  
  Its kinda like a parent who tells their child not to do something knowing their going to do it anyway. The parent is hurt deeply at the act of disobedience, however, the child must still suffer the consequences.The parent could already forsee the outcome, just like God. The child may ask the parent for forgiveness, and the parent will still love the child unconditionally.
  
  I hope this gentle response finds you well.

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  by redbonecandycone on November 14th, 2009

• @redbone "Sin became a part of man once he disobeyed God in the Garden of Eden" But what made him disobey God in the first place? When there was no sin in the world why did he choose to disobey God?
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  Incidentally, if you read Genesis very carefully you'll see that;
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  1. God doesn't tell Eve not to eat the forbidden fruit, only Adam.
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  2. Eve doesn't tell Adam that the fruit that she is giving him is the forbidden fruit.
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  3. Eve isn't punished for eating the fruit but for being deceived by the serpent.
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  4. The serpent doesn't tell her to give any to Adam nor does he tell Adam to eat any.
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  5. Adam isn't punished for eating the fruit but for listening to / trusting Eve.
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  6. Most of what the serpent says to Eve is actually true.
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  7. Most of what God says to Adam is either false or is a deception.
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  8. Adam and Eve did not die upon the day that they ate of the fruit, like God said that they would. They died because God kicked them out of the Garden, and he did this so that they would not be able to eat from the tree of life. If they had eaten from both trees , God says that they would indeed have become like him - which is actually what the serpent said in the first place.

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  by Hyperion is back in China on November 14th, 2009

• The Adam and Eve story isn't as straightforward as most people think it is.

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  by Hyperion is back in China on November 14th, 2009

• Yes, it is beginning of a conceited fraud.
  *
  Biblical god must be some local warlord of limited influence over his Eden, as Bible clearly describes (prosperous) places on (flat!)earth without God’s presence, where it was entirely possible for deported and exiled murderers like Cain to prosper for generations!
  e.g., The city of Enoch, Nod, east of Eden! (Genesis-4:16-18).
  How impotent, powerless and pro-criminal is the Lord!
  (Cain never repented, according to Bible!)

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  by ScienceSwamy on November 14th, 2009

• rbcc is a typical unemployed blind-believer
  acting as a part-time preacher
  prawling, or curb-crawling AB!
  No sale & not sorry!
  *
  This is what happens
  of believers in non-existent non-entities of nonsense.
  
  It would be insult to monkeys & rats to say
  that religion makes monkeys or rats out of educated ‘e-literate’ people
  believing in gods, godp imps and peddlers of other superstitions.

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  by ScienceSwamy on November 14th, 2009

• Hype... You dedicated real time to your response and I can appreciate that; however, I don't need factual evidence to prove the particulars of the Bible, nor do I feel a need to justify my position. I stand on Faith.
  
  Swamy... What can I say dude? Your lacerating tongue had me doubled over in laughter. Your so good you should be getting paid to talk like that. Somebody give this guy a hug and a warm bowl of chicken noodle soup. ;)

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  by redbonecandycone on November 14th, 2009

• @redbone
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  I didn't ask you for factual evidence to prove the particulars of the Bible, nor did I ask you to justify your position.
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  My questions were -
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  1. "what made him [Adam] disobey God in the first place"
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  2. "When there was no sin in the world why did he [Adam] choose to disobey God"
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  I then pointed out that Genesis doesn't say that Adam did anything wrong. Your view of the story in which Adam brings sin into the world isn't supported by the actual words of Genesis. If you believe that the Bible is the word of God, then shouldn't you rely on the words themselves rather than the version of story that later generations of church leaders put out.
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  Having faith is all well and good but your faith seems to be in the words of men rather than the words of God.
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  On the subject of faith - you seem to feel that it is a good thing to have. But did God or Jesus or any prophet generally thought of as speaking on God's behalf ever say that the Bible was God's word or that you should have faith in it?

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  by Hyperion is back in China on November 14th, 2009

• Did God ever say that having faith in his existence without any proof of it was something that he wished mankind to have?
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  The OT talks about having faith that God would honor his covenants with his people not about faith in his existence. The NT talks about having faith that Jesus is the Son of God - again it's not about faith in God's existence. The people in the Bible didn't have faith in God's existence - they didn't need to. They had evidence of it by God/Jesus' supposed appearances and actions.
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  The kind of faith that you say you have is the invention of the early church leaders who tried to convince people that God and Jesus exist despite them never appearing or demonstrating their existence.

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  by Hyperion is back in China on November 14th, 2009

• In all honesty Hype... I have no interest in having a long drawn out debate with you, nor did I take time to read your lengthy response... I simply answered the original question of the original AB subscriber, and I'm not in the business to have a "round table discussion" with you or your very nice pal swamy. If you want answers to your questions, than find someone who has the interest to entertain them, because I don't. It's not my place to convince you of what my faith stands on.
  
  Have a great Sunday and God bless you!!!

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  by redbonecandycone on November 14th, 2009

• Understood. You are under no obligation to answer or comment - it's matter of personal choice.

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  by Hyperion is back in China on November 15th, 2009

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• Wow. You sure have spent enough time in the bible to be so informative. In fact, you seem quite obsessed.

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  by redbonecandycone on November 14th, 2009

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