I cannot support the death penalty for several reasons.
The first is that we know that at least sometimes innocent people end up getting convicted - and even ONE is too many. Sometimes they end up in prison or even death row for years, sometimes even potentially being executed. When the State executes an innocent man it has committed an act of murder. That sounds like a "death-penalty-worthy" crime to me, but who will execute the State? From where will the punishment for that come? Yes, the family can sue for wrongful death. Big deal. When do we charge the State with murder, let it defend itself in trial, and be judged by a jury of its peers? Convict and sentence it? Admittedly, at the (now dead) innocent victim's trial reasonable doubt could not be found for a not guilty verdict, but the State still incorporated a death penalty into its penal system fully cognizant that it was possible for an innocent man to be convicted. That's the crime.
The second reason is that it interferes with or outright prevents a country's ability to extradite criminals to face trial in that country. If a criminal (including terrorists) seeks refuge in a country without the death penalty, and then they are apprehended and there is a desire for the criminal to be extradited by a country with the death penalty as a probable sentence, it can and does happen that the extradition process will not happen. This actually prevents some of the worst people from actually facing justice.
The third reason is that it's ineffectual. There is no statistical evidence that it lowers crime rates. It also is one of those penalties that has a built in "cap" on the negative incentive not to be a repeat offender. If I murder one person and know I will face the death penalty, why not two, or three, or four? Of course I might not get caught. But what if they know they've been tied to the murder(s) with strong evidence and will almost certainly be convicted? Why try to avoid raising the body count (including killing law enforcement officials) in the act of trying to elude capture? Can you be killed more than once? Rhetorical question, that.
The rest of my reasons for not supporting the death penalty are mostly broader ethical / philosophical issues. What value can a society place on life if the State itself (meant to be representative of the culture, the people, the values, especially in democracies and republics) takes lives? How does that impact the value that individuals will place on life? Who decides which acts are "unpardonable"? Who decides which people are beyond redemption, or haven't already redeemed, especially when they often face the prospect of dying for years of appeals. Karla Faye Tucker back in Texas in 1998 comes to mind, where EVERYONE who talked to her was convinced she had changed and was no longer the same person she was when she committed the murders and was genuinely repentant. On a civil liberties note, do we really want the State to have the legal power / option to KILL us? Let's face it, if the State wants to find you, it usually finds you, especially with the growing powers many governments are taking in the interests of "national security". To paraphrase the song, if you "[fight] the law, the law [will win]". The State may already be an emerging Big Brother with practically unlimited power and such a complex legal system that not even a seasoned lawyer may know every possible law we MIGHT be breaking at any moment without looking it up. Do we really want to allow the State to also decide when we die, under ANY circumstances? Dangerous precedent, slippery slope.
I'm not saying if someone killed someone that I loved, that I wouldn't want them dead, might not even do it myself, and, barring that, wouldn't want the State to execute them. But that's how I'd FEEL, what I'd WANT. Me, being not in a state of mind to be objective. It wouldn't be what was RIGHT. I would say in that situation "to hell with what's right!". And the tragic thing is that that was probably exactly what the killer was thinking.
Comments
You keep the prison numbers in control that way as well. The prisons in the UK are practically bloody luxury. It takes the mick tbf. x
by Stephy1990 on March 15th, 2010
I understand your rage, most of the violent offenders you speak of are extremely rare, crimes like this are crimes of passion and the victim usually knows their attacker. its a thing of how the victim behaved around the attacker and the fact that the attacker is without a clear view of morality or simply has no compasion. These criminals as hitler discovered make the absolute best combat soldiers. So every one even a raging psychopath can be redirected to help you. killing them as happlessly as they killed is hating the reflection that greets you every morning. who will you kill when the criminals are gone? how will your justice function when their is no clear or justifiable victim for you? before long your targeting gays and hispanics then blacks and muslims then its on to the unemployed litering your streets and then the rebelion that leaves the nation poor for a hundred years. more killing is not the answer.
by Mud on March 16th, 2010
Indeed, Jimmy. People only get wound up about stuff that is rare enough to make the news.
Where's the rage about all the poor little children who get run over by cars every year?
by bolwerk on March 16th, 2010
i agree with katsuona and people who take life like that should be killed at the very least.
by The Silent Rebel on March 16th, 2010
What if we changed the term "death penalty" to transfer to the "next level" or "move them on to another plane".
by Koz - Passion Perseverance Patience on March 16th, 2010
Crimes like this aren't THAT rare. Ever noticed how we made it into the #1 spot on the list of countries with the most murders per year? We're one of the nicest and most decent countries on earth- but that doesn't at all mean that we can't also have the highest number of psychos.
One might question, "How can we be both the most decent country on earth and also have the largest number of crimes?". Think of it proportionately, maybe other countries have more murders by ratio, but America is a much larger country than others, so by percentage we have more criminals to deal with than other smaller countries.
by Katsuona on March 16th, 2010
Katsuona, that's the most mathematically inept reasoning I have ever witnessed on the Internet tubes.
If anything, there's a mass hysteria of cruelty in American politics (this year instantiated by the Teabaggers). The same disregard for human life that causes the U.S. to have an unusually high murder rate is probably what causes demagogic politicians to bat their eyes at the death penalty.
by bolwerk on March 16th, 2010
good point bolwerk, I would add that the cruelty is all threatening talk untill the talk fails and the threats must be acted upon to remain involved in the present conversation. be it health care or terrorists, proper behaviour never allows for threatening talk as it only promisses to demand action.
by Mud on March 17th, 2010
i know what you mean but if we execute murderers then how are we any better than them?!
by wwww789 on March 17th, 2010
Well for one thing if they only receive a life sentence then they're still likely to murder someone. Prisons may be secure but even with as many guards as there must be in those facilities, they can't see everything coming.
Where on the other hand, if they're executed, they can never hurt or kill anyone ever again. And let me reiterate what I said before: They make their victims SUFFER. We make it painless for them, they get an easy way out as opposed to how they treated their victims.
by Katsuona on March 17th, 2010
Katsuona pretty much gives the exact reason why the death penalty *shouldn't* exist: it's not about justice (which is what applying the law is supposedly about). It's about revenge.
by bolwerk on March 17th, 2010
"Justice" and "Revenge" are interchangable words!
In just about every sentence I have read, here, the words can be interchanged, and mean the same thing!
Stop the bullshit!
Justice IS revenge.
by Rip Van Winkle on March 20th, 2010
Huh, interesting way of doing things. Keep animals well fed, and rid the world of useless psychopaths who seek only to cause harm to other people.
by Katsuona on March 20th, 2010
Idea.... how about, instead of putting them in death row, we put them all in a single locked room with a single t.v. that shows Barney 24/7. Surely they would all kill themselves by the end of the week. :3
by Aspergers syndrome on March 24th, 2010
You know last year (or probably the year before) there were some teenagers who were punished in a similar way. They were arrested for playing their instruments too loudly and disturbing the peace of the neighborhood.
Their punishment was being locked in a room with a CD that only played Barney songs. Bet that caused a heck of an ear sore lol
by Katsuona on March 24th, 2010
Justice and revenge have nothing to do with each other. The latter is simply pleasure for the victim or, worse, bystanders who have nothing to do with the matter. The former is a social process that /attempts/ to find an equitable solution.
by bolwerk on March 24th, 2010
Same differance!
by Rip Van Winkle on March 24th, 2010
Geez people can we please give it a rest? 19 or 20 comments is enough for one answer right? I stand by my answer and in no way want to change peoples' minds.
I simply gave my opinion just as other people gave theirs, but I'm not trying to convert anyone to my way of thinking, that would be unconstitutional and just plain wrong.
by Katsuona on March 24th, 2010
I agree, Katsuona. I'm not on here trying to change anyone's opinon on the subject.
I'm just stating my opinon. I know what is right and wrong, to me! And I stand by it!
by Rip Van Winkle on March 24th, 2010
I can't argue with your statement. I have pondered this many times and don't see a good reason for keeping these people. But, I also read about the people who are, years later, found to be not-guilty. So, can we kill without absolute proof? There are cases where "proof" is manufactured by the authorities. Maybe if there were witnesses, camera shots, videos. People like Charles Manson, with no value at all to society, okay, kill him. Let's face it, we kill vermin all the time. We poison them, trap them, shoot them, but they aren't human. So what the heck is the answer? I don't want to make that final decision.
by mrrw on June 28th, 2010
Good point. Authorities do on some occasions come up with their own "evidence", and that can sometimes result in an innocent person being convicted of a crime that someone else committed. It's a sad truth, but I can't see any way to change it, I'm just one human being after all.
Personally, I hope never to have to pull the trigger on any human being, criminal or not. But if someone forces my hand, I will not have any other choice. I would kill and/or be killed to defend myself and my family.
More over, I have plans to join the Navy. If someone enters the military not expecting to have to kill a bad guy, they're entering the military completely unprepared, and are set to fail the minute they step in.
by Katsuona on June 28th, 2010
very good however the replacing of evidence is a mastery of our military
by Mud on July 1st, 2010
No-one on this site has sufficient information to justify keeping or discontinuing the "Death Penalty" in the USA. Taking opposing views, this is a subject that can be discussed and debated by intelligent people without them ever reaching an agreement on what is best.
So I thought I ought to use some help and a bit of common sense.
How many countries in the world are still using capital punishment?
According to Amnesty International, in 2009 there were 18 countries around the world. With the exception of Japan (7 executions) and the USA (52 executions) there isn't a single country in the West that still uses this form of punishment.
Does that mean that the 18 countries got it right and all the rest of the world got it wrong, including those in the process of abolishing it?
My peronal view is irrelevant but when I look at these facts, I draw my own conclusions.
by Abbra gone Underground on July 1st, 2010
and now the vultures come to degrade the posts as if were NOT talking from personal feelings but instead actively changing the death penalty. lame
by Mud on July 2nd, 2010
No one who kills is in their right mind, I believe. Often they need pyschiatric help. Is it fair to kill someone who happens to be mentally deranged?
by Twibbieful on December 28th, 2010
well it is a bit ironic that we take god diving us life more seriously than god does, I mean god doesn't kill people for any reason we kill them to send them to god and then god tells the newly killed..."So now it's over, let's talk about it." but we think he wants us choosing who should live, which is what got whoever into the lethal injection in the first place, but when the state does it its right. because they only kill to improve society, which is nothing more than a business. So to the outsider, you either do as your told or you'll be caught up in some modern witch hunt and destroyed.
by Mud on December 28th, 2010