Should we be putting animals into zoos?

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• how are we getting educated about moon and mars?

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  by itinary on June 16th, 2010

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• That pretty much says how i feel. Reserves are more and more becoming a neccesary evil.

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  by Midnighttoker on June 9th, 2010

• If people would stop destroying animals natural habitat we wouldn't need sancuarys

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  by TDthegreat on November 26th, 2010

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• Thanks for sharing a very interesting perspective. In Chicago's Lincoln Park Zoo (free zoo) the animals are in natural habitats, but they are not so very large. In the Brookfield Zoo, on the other hand, the animals roam free in large areas, and the people are in the cages and enclosed walkways, watching them. Who is watching who? Hmmm....

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  by Chicago Lady on June 7th, 2010

• Hmmm..... Do you think we could open the cages? ;-)

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  by Marky Mark on June 8th, 2010

• Ok, you run and open the cages and make a mad dash back here. I'll wait for you in the car. I'll keep the motor running... :-)

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  by Chicago Lady on June 8th, 2010

• Hehehehe! ;-D

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  by Marky Mark on June 8th, 2010

• good answer

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  by IllFight4Peace on February 23rd, 2011

• Thanks!

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  by Marky Mark on February 23rd, 2011

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• What's the difference between a zoo and a reserve? You still have people taking animals, helping them out, teaching the public about the environment and the destruction that's going on. The only difference is that in a zoo, an animal isn't going to escape and then get pounced on by poachers. Sure, zoos are never going to measure up to the real environment, but you know what? They do their best, and I think that if a zoo was in really bad shape, a Zoologist would be quitting, or trying to change it in a more positive approach.

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  by MsSmartAss on June 7th, 2010

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• Or you can just care in the first place

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  by jeremyraymondarey on February 16th, 2011

• Maybe 1% of people will 'care in the first place'. Why not increase those numbers via education? Liberals are always crying that we don't spend enough on education anyway, why should this area be ignored?

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  by LarryH54 on March 23rd, 2011

• Hmm...never pass up an opportunity to get a jab in at us libs, eh Larry?
  
  You do have a point though, universal education is an important priority (for me anyway).

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  by Anonymous on March 23rd, 2011

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• That is horrible and cruel. What part of the world are you from? I live in America and here animals are treated very well in zoos and they live in big, open habitats. They are never kept locked up and enclosed in tiny cages. I think that locking an animal in a cage is terrible and inhumane.

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  by Vaporeongirl on June 7th, 2010

• So what is our purpose to live? We're born, we grown up, we work to survive, and we pay taxes. What is the point of our lives other than working for other people?
  Animals are around so that we can enjoy life and appreciate it more for what it's worth. There's has to be more to an animals life then just eatting right? Okay, well.. it hunts, so that it can eat. Some of them look pretty. Some of them are used for us to eat, some of them are just there so that we could watch them grow and just learn different things from them.
  You meet someone, you don't know what their purpose in life is, so really.. they're just there, but you observe them, you learn from them and educate yourself more about some issues that you see (from observation) could be effecting them.
  Really.. we're all lab mice, we're all observant of eachother and learning different things. I've read certain stories of war tactics that were developed from a certain bug or animal.

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  by MsSmartAss on June 7th, 2010

• I know, animals are beautiful and wonderful, aren't they? Though, you agree they shouldn't just be stuffed in cages and abused, right? I believe in keeping animals in zoos as long as they have lots of space to roam around in and all their needs are met.

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  by Vaporeongirl on June 7th, 2010

• And that's how it is for most zoos. A Zoologist isn't going to go to college for an X amount of years, get a degree, so that they can make money doing something professionally by having animals kept in an unsanitary or unacceptable environment, it's not going to happen.
  Sure, some zoos are horrible... their sanitary isn't up to date and they may get a pass one time, but they'll usually get shut down if the zoo isn't up to standards.
  I don't think it's fair to a tiger to be 24/7 in a cage that's 5x5, I mean.. even when they go to their cage to rest overnight and sometimes be fed or get medical treatment, their cage isn't even that small. Everyone is treating the zoo like it's a slaughter house, "it's unclean, animals are stuffed in tight cages"
  And I've said to several people before, animals don't view cages like humans view cages... the communication between an animal and a human is completely different, and so in the thinking, the instinct and the comforts of life are different.

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  by MsSmartAss on June 8th, 2010

• Good, I'm glad to meet other people that believe in humane treatment of animals while keeping them in captivity.

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  by Vaporeongirl on June 8th, 2010

• Vaporeongirl! I'm not talking about the conditions of the zoos or the way animals were treated in that zoo. I'm talking about the fact that those wild animals aren't suposed to be in a limited area which I conseder as a cage for them. It can be any zoo in any country. A lion for example needs to roam around and hunt for it's food, that is in it's nature. It's not supposed to wait for sliced meats they throw in front of it and the cage in a zoo can't be that big or else visitors aren't going to be able to see them!

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  by Sokoot on June 9th, 2010

• I see what you mean now. I actually do agree that they should give them live prey to hunt. But animals like lions are pretty lazy even in the wild and only live in a limited territory anyway. As long as they give them lots of space and live prey, it's OK. But, if we don't keep animals in zoos, how will we conserve endangered species?

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  by Vaporeongirl on June 9th, 2010

• National parks can be a solution.

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  by Sokoot on June 9th, 2010

• ... You both are nuts.
  Live prey to hunt... IN A ZOO? lol.. give me a break. The zoo wouldn't be up to health standards and it wouldn't be the true purpose of the zoo, which it did start out as saving wifelife, but now it's more reproduction and education/entertainment purposes.
  And as I said before, Lions live in dens, they appreciate having their own space that they can call to themselves and knowing that the spot in THAT den is THEIRS. You take that space away from them, you're gonna see one pissed off pussy cat.

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  by MsSmartAss on June 9th, 2010

• And also, not every animal is psychologically the same. Take Giant Pandas for example, it's VERY rare for them to set the mood to actually mate, and zoologists have to resort to taking sperm from the male and putting it in the female just for reproduction.

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  by MsSmartAss on June 9th, 2010

• Zoos are for saving WIFElife! That made me smile!
  Ms! You better learn to handle a simple discussion like what we're having here without going out of the line and insulting other people. And this is the last time I'm saying this, none of those wild animals want to be taken away from their homes. And you give them space to be their Territory?! If they could talk they would probably say no thank you, leave us be in our homes and we will find our territories on our own!

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  by Sokoot on June 9th, 2010

• Zoos, in the beginning of them were for observing the world around us (science).
  How are zoos saving wildlife when only 1% of zoo animals are from wildlife?
  Yeah, maybe I said (which.. I sure as hell can't find, so I would love to see a quote), that some zoos save wildlife by having mating programs and trying to repopulate that actual species of animal... or sometimes zoos will bring in animals so they can give them medical treatment (if needed) and them let them back to the wild later.
  
  None of the animals want to be taken away from their homes? Sure, I would hate to be taken away from my home, but you know what? If giant machines are coming up to my house and ready to knock it down, I hope you know I would be running my ass off. Come on, get serious... look at the world and see at how it's change since 1900. We have more buildings, more cities, bigger cities, bigger population, bigger desire to have better houses and housing... you really think that as the population is sky rocketing, that the environment is going to be the same? Because if you think that, you're lying to yourself. I live in Jersey, the most densly populated state, and I don't know how many times I have woken up and seen deer and wild turkey in my back yard because they don't have their homes like they used to.
  Look at the rainforests, there's how many miles being torn down everyday? Maybe not as much as before, but it's still happening. Giant Pandas, look at their food supply, it's getting less and less each year. So.. that 1% of actual "wild life" that's in zoos... you really think they're complaining? Yeah, certain animals need to feed their desire and their instinct of chasing something and getting amusement, but you don't think those needs are met? Really, they'd be going completely out of their minds.
  I even walk my dog everyday, if I didn't walk my dog for a week (which I had to do one time) she went crazy and started chasing the cat all over the house, and that's her breed... her breed's job was made for hunting, guarding, and fighting.

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  by MsSmartAss on June 10th, 2010

• As you also said saving animals who are losing their homes is not what zoos are made for. That's the job for the national parks. And what do you mean only 1% of the animals in the zoos are from wild life? Are the rest born inside the zoos?

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  by Sokoot on June 10th, 2010

• "Today, roughly 98 to 99 percent of our zoo mammals come from other zoos, where specially selected animals are chosen to breed to help create a diverse population within the species"
  
  Did you even read both sides of the debate?
  First off, zoos take in, not only national parks, injured animals and give them medication. Yes, it may be the job for "national park" but if the zoo recieves an injured animal, you think they're going to call national parks to handle the job? No.
  So while National Parks do save the animals and may even offer a "reserve", guess what, those animals aren't caged in and there are going to be poachers standing right outside that fence waiting.

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  by MsSmartAss on June 10th, 2010

• That statastic is debatable yet it is irrelevant to what I was saying. Wild animals should be in wild no matter where they are coming from, that's all I'm saying.
  
  I never said anything about injured animals. That's cool if zoos take care of them or orphans but they should get them back to the wild as soon as possible.
  
  There are some cool things zoos do or can do. For example there is a zoo here which asks families to give their pets, specially the birds, which they don't want in their house anymore to the zoo instead of leaving them in parks. These are things zoos should take care of.

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  by Sokoot on June 12th, 2010

• Okay, so dogs should be out in the wild to? Because that's where they started from... and I'm sure they still have instincts. And cats, you let one out and it will be able to fend for itself... so, we should let them out in the wild also. While we're at it, fish don't like to be kept in glass bowls, not that I ever interviewed one or anything, but they gotta come from somewhere. And birds, let's just get rid of all the birds, finches, macaws, etc, we should just let them go and destroy even personal aviaries, oh.. we can't forget the small animals: Hedgehogs, chinchillas, armidillos, skunks, guinea pigs, rats, any mice, I mean, none of them are domesticated are they? Nah.. and the reptiles, snakes, iguanas, bearded dragons, would should just let them all go so that no one should have ownership of animals, there will be no zoos so that people can understand nature and what's around them in different areas of the world, there would be no animal rescues, no breeders, alot of job cuts and a ton of animals running around that people would have to resort to hunting. Yeah, that soulds like a good idea. You're really onto something. The job cuts that would come with it and the industry that comes with animals would be insane and completely shatter the economy, that's how much money to dedicated to animals.
  You have people who run rescues (which is where I got my dog from), you have dog food companies, even dog shows, pet grooming, pet stores (which I don't agree with a lot of them because some of them support Dog Mills instead of actual Breeders), you have Breeders, The Circus, Zoos and their employees, a lot of vetinarians.
  
  lol... You can't cherry-pick. Animals, domesticated or not still have instict for the wild, and if you're going to say "wild animals belong in the wild" then they'll all have to go in the wild. You can't say "well... I like dogs, and I have a pet dog, so I can't give little Peaches here up". Sure, it seems like I'm being dramatic about "if you're going to put animals in the wild, put every animals in the wild" but that's how they started.
  If a zoo can't even take care of an animal, then why should households (who have the most animal abuse) take care of animals? I mean, people... some people are just horrible, there are dog fights, cock fights, and people who just abuse animals in general, even some public figures will abuse animals (Mike Vick for example) and they'll get away with it because he can play football... and you'd be surprised at how many people in sports have commited abuse in general.
  
  So for me, supply and demand. You can't look at a zoo and say "this is a bad zoo so all of them are this way" and vise versa for a for good zoos... there's bad and there's good, so you don't support the bad and have them close down, and you support the good. I mean, come on, no wild animals in the zoo? That's a ton of lost money, no one's going to pay money to see all the different breeds of dogs and cats there are that we have domesticated, and even then, some dogs, which are the more rare breeds, some of them still are wild and have not been domesticated yet.
  That defeats the entire purpose of the zoo to not have wild animals.

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  by MsSmartAss on June 13th, 2010

• I just said my opinion, I'm not a devote animal rights activist or anything, for instance I eat meat like it's nobody's business!!
  But I think you understood what I said up there and you already know that by that I didn't mean we should throw all the animals in the wild. For example dogs and cats no longer fit in the wild or birds like canarys and lovebirds belong in the cages and won't last long out there by themselves. And the question is asking for my opinion about the zoos; if those things you said is happening in households then I'm going to object them too. I think you sheepishly admitted yourself that zoos are out there for making money since there are organisations that are already taking care of all the jobs you named that zoos should take care of. And about zoos being edjucational I say it again that I doubt watching a lion laying on the ground waiting for it's meal is going to teach anything about it's way of life in wild to a child so if people want to learn about them they can watch documentaries about their lives.

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  by Sokoot on June 13th, 2010

• Birds like canarys or love birds? Where do you think they get those birds? Sure, there's breeders out there, but most birds will come from the wild, I'm sure. It's not like small birds are a "designer breed", they do come from somewhere in the wild... we didn't just make them up.
  
  Lol... yeah, I'll ask my kids that whenever I have any. "Who wants to go see a lion! Awesome, let me bring up google..." like.. yeah, that's real fun and exciting. No one is going to be interested in learning if they're not excited, kids learn through excitement, and what's more exciting to a kid than an animal? That's why there's also class pets, kids love animals. I could show my cousins a picture of an animal and they light up and get all excited. And zoos do have posts that contain information about animals, I mean, if you just have a zoo near you that has animals in cages and they don't offer any information, then I could see your point, but then that would ruin the purpose of a zoo, wouldn't it?
  Your whole statement was crazy... I want to go to France one day to see the city and the sights, would looking all that on google be the same? No... so why would you even think that googling an exotic and a magnificent creature would be the same as seeing it up close? Yeah, instead of scuba-diving for my honeymoon, I'll just look up pictures of some fish... that's definately the same experience.

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  by MsSmartAss on June 14th, 2010

• I said if someone wnt to "learn" they can watch documentaries, where did I mention about the excitment? Yeah visiting a zoo may be fun but not educational and I already told you why.

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  by Sokoot on June 14th, 2010

• This is where people relate words to things. I relate the word "documentary" to boring.. and most people do. Personally, if I want to learn about an animal, I'd rather go to the zoo then to sit there and watch an hour long thing describing to me the diet of a lion. If I want to learn about art, instead of sitting in a class for hours and hearing a person talk, I'd rather go to an art museum and really see it upclose and possibly listen to an audio tape.
  
  
  Sure, there's people out there who would rather read and watch things to learn, I mean, that's mostly how I learn. I'm highly interested in psychology and abilities as well as disabilities, I love the psychological build of serial killers and crazy people, does that mean I'm going to go to jail and try to hunt down the modern day Charles Manson? Erm... probably not, maybe if I were writting a book or something I would try and get an interview in, so.. for some things I would read things up on, but sometimes you just can't beat the experience that comes with it, and I'm sorry, but when it comes to the overall factor of education and really having things stuck to your mind, going to the zoo beats watching a documentary because it's a far more exciting experience, and that's what stick, things that stick out.

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  by MsSmartAss on June 14th, 2010

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• Dogs like to be around humans but that's irrelevant to the question. Are you saying that lions and tigers and bears also find it comfortable in cages?!

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  by Sokoot on June 7th, 2010

• ... Dogs can be around humans and be in a cage at the same time. No one said "dogs liked to be locked in a cage, in a seperate room sfrom humans with the door closed".
  First off... look at lions, they do have a resting place, a "den".. they do need their room and their space in order to call their own. If another animal or lion invades that den, there's bound to be some trouble. Same thing goes for bears, bears have dens, they have their own place where they rest, if something invades that area that they feel belongs to them, there's trouble. Tigers, are like lions and bears, they have dens. They're territorial over their space, which, they need their space.
  Like I said, for people, which people crave to be social and accepted, we have an opinion that a cage is like a jail, because that's what happens. If we do something bad, we get put into a cage and we're cut off socially, so for us, it's bad... and it seems like a crowded and a dark situation, but for an animal.. that is a space that is promised to them, that it is their domain.

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  by MsSmartAss on June 7th, 2010

• A lion wants to hunt for it's meal, I doubt that they even want to be taken care of unless they have some kind of disability or something.

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  by Sokoot on June 9th, 2010

• A lion hunts for it's meal naturally because it HAS to. Yes, a lion has a craving for chasing something and getting that energy they have out, and that's why zoos should be paying attention to that need of an animal like that, and providing a toy in which they could release their energy instead of keeping them bottled up.

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  by MsSmartAss on June 13th, 2010

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• I can't agree more. When was the last time anyone saw a happy enclosed, caged animal. Mostly the animals are there to make profit. No morales there then. Thanks

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  by clickon on December 28th, 2007

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• Way Forward galeanda! Caged animals are so depressing. We also had the "sugar-puff bear" here in our small zoo. It was in a pathetic state in a cage then they made an open-air pit and then it pulled some kids arm off one night they had broken in. More recently our small town zoo was broken into by 13 and 14 yr olds who cut and disfigured many of the penned in animals, some of which had to be put down. Thanks for your answer.

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  by clickon on December 28th, 2007

• How horrible. I can't imagine anyone doing that. It sickens me. Yes, down with small zoos with limited budgets and sad animals. Take them to sanctuaries for the rest of their lives and don't ever do it again:-(

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  by Galeanda on December 28th, 2007

• There has been a local campaign to close our load of sadness and I like your suggestion. Many poeple just don't want to think about sad bad things but given a way out they would most certainly prefer it. Sancturaries are the most acceptable form of "keeping" animals.

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  by clickon on December 28th, 2007

• I'm hoping for the best for your zoo. Maybe something positive will be done. The one we had back in California got more money and space unfortunately. I just wanted them to close.

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  by Galeanda on December 28th, 2007

• Thanks for your good wishes. It's nice to know we are not all bad or just plain naive. I also wish the wee californian zoo and it's internees all the very best.

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  by clickon on December 28th, 2007

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• Animals don't look at a cage like humans look at a cage. As humans, we strive to be social and be accepted, and when we do something bad, we're put in jail - a cage. For an animal, a cage is that animal's area, their personal space.
  The confusion that people get when they think of animal and cage couldn't be far from the truth. Cesar Millan, dog trainer expert, even believes in cages because it does show that it dramatically calms the animal down when it knows it has it's on place within it's den.
  I could give a hundred examples of people I know who have dogs, and that dog has ANYWHERE to lay in their house, but it chooses the same spot everyday, and if the family has a cage for that dog, the dog will most likely be in the cage.
  Animals like hyenas, tigers, lions, bears, pack animals, they all work like that. If you have a bird, what do you keep it in? A cage that is good in measurement for the bird.

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  by MsSmartAss on June 7th, 2010

• Not all animals are den animals. True while a dog may look at a cage differently a bird sure do not because it is not a den animal.

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  by ellesheen on June 9th, 2010

• And that is true.. and that's why I said in another post to someone else on here that yes, peopl ekeep exotic birds as animals and keep them in cages, hell.. I grew up with animals and even had my own umbrella cockatoo at 13 years old.. what's the difference if a bird is in the cage at the zoo or in someone's home? A bird is a bird and a cage is a cage.. you just need to know the type of bird you're dealing with, what treats it needs, temperment (like any other animal), and the space it needs, the attention it requires (like any other animal again).

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  by MsSmartAss on June 9th, 2010

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• I think many of our primates would excel in MacDonalds (perhaps not enough stimulation though) as long as they aren't of the eating kind.

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  by clickon on December 28th, 2007

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