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by sooz74 on November 21st, 2009
Hate often stems from ignorance. People who hate various groups (different ethnicites, religious groups homosexuals, etc...) are less likely to engage in individual thought and more likely to follow the crowd. When asked to provide an argument for their beliefs, they either have nothing to say, or spew misinformation, false stereotypes, and generalizations that have been fed to them by others.
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You're reading Why do people who are completely ignorant of Islam hate it so much?
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Comments
YOU just made a gross generalization. "...they either have nothing to say, or spew misinformation, false stereotypes, and generalizations that have been fed to them by others." This statement is not logical.
by Theby on November 22nd, 2009
Interesting. You do realize sooz is defending your assumed discrimination against and victimization of Islam don't you Theby?
I find myself in full agreement with you Theby which in itself is a very strange feeling.
I would disagree also with sooz74 and say that the discomfort with Islam begins as you learn about Islam, and unless you submit and become a beneficiary umder the Koran or a member of the Muslim brotherhood, for it is extremely chauvinistic, the revulsion grows with knowledge.
by puzzled on November 22nd, 2009
Sooz is not defending Islam.
by Theby on November 22nd, 2009
That's my Theby. :)
No you're correct Theby, She is though haranguing its detractors. Which is I suppose different if you're pedantic. I assume sooz is female? It could be So Oz?
Still I would be really interested, i fail to see how Sooz's statement is illogical, incorrect yes, but how illogical?
by puzzled on November 22nd, 2009
Meh. Go figure.
by Theby on November 22nd, 2009
I believe I may have misunderstood the question. My answer was in response to what I understood the question to be asking - why do people hate something they have no knowledge of (completely ignorant of). I agree that feelings, including revulsion, can grow with knowledge and that discomfort can begin as you learn, but this speaks to those who are not ignorant, but rather are educated in or have an understanding of what it is that evokes such feelings.
I viewed the question as asking about hatred felt specifically by those who do not have any knowledge or understanding of Islam and very different than a question such as "why do people hate Islam" to which an explanation of feelings influenced by an increased understanding of practices and beliefs related to Islam would be appropriate. I thought the key part of the question was not about hatred toward Islam per say, but how or why people can hate something they know nothing about. If I felt hatred toward Islam, for example, yet was completely ignorant of Islam, what would be the basis of my hatred? What would I say to support my hatred of a subject I knew nothing about? If a person expresses hatred toward something they are completely ignorant of, their feelings cannot be based on knowledge of the truth (not compatible with complete ignorance). It stands to reason then that the hatred is either based something that has been imagined or invented, or is based on information that is in fact not true, perpetuating ignorance. I fail to see why the proposition that hatred of something without any knowledge or understanding (being completely ignorant of what is hated) is likely motivated by misinformation, generalization, and stereotypes is incorrect. If a question was broader and asked about people's views on or hatred toward Islam, my answer would also have been broader.
by sooz74 on November 24th, 2009
I am curious, Theby, if your have any thoughts regarding your question - perhaps may help me understand why you find my answer a generalization and illogical. I am sincerely and respectfully interested, not trying to take a jab at you. I would also like to add my 2 cents to what I was and wasn't doing in my answer in reaction to conclusions drawn. I was neither defending nor attacking Islam - I don't think my opinion for or against is relevant to the question. I was not so much commenting on the hatred shown, but on feelings and opinions expressed, particularly when they show hostility or judgment toward others, toward something one has know knowledge of. I guess you could argue I was haranguing its detractors, but only in reference to those who speak of that they do not know. I have my own beliefs and opinions regarding various issues, practices, groups, etc... and openly share these with others. At the same time, I understand and appreciate we do not all see things the same. I enjoy a debate in which information is offered, opinions vocalized, and all parties are given the opportunity to provide a knowledgeable argument to support their statements. I believe strongly in the ability to disagree without hostility or contempt, the exception being when that different view promotes or causes harm to others (gay bashing or white supremacy groups for example). Finally, to satisfy expressed interest, I am a woman (sooz = Susan). I could be completely wrong, but felt the comment re: my gender were tied into the determination I was criticizing those who are opposed to chauvinism. While this is not what I was doing, as a feminist who actively participates in educating others about violence against women and counsels, supports, and advocates for women who have experienced abuse, I want to make it clear I have zero tolerance for such mistreatment.
I think perhaps I have gone overboard on the comments, but felt the need to clarify and defend myself against assumptions made about me and of the meaning of my answer, that I feel were unwarranted.
by sooz74 on November 24th, 2009
Yadda....
by Theby on November 24th, 2009
passive aggressive
by sooz74 on November 24th, 2009
Meet me in person and you will find I have passivity.
by Theby on November 25th, 2009
I'll take your word for it. Was there something I wrote or something about me that has offended you?
by sooz74 on November 25th, 2009
Your intellect overwhelms Theby, sooz74, and has rendered her speechless. Very brilliant answer and comments on your behalf sooz74.:)+6
by Bohemian is back on November 27th, 2009
Thank you, was starting to wonder if I was missing something or just completely off base. Really don't like that feeling of being talked about while in the same room, especially when conclusions are being drawn about my intent and beliefs. You made me feel better :)
by sooz74 on November 27th, 2009
No argument with you sooz except you used the time worn argument of the liberal's.
If I'd stood still long enough on a corner in London I may have found that Jack the ripper was really a nice misunderstood guy, if I'd befriended him and accepted he be rehoused next door, then you know that it works because it's been done before and the complainant always stopped complaining soon after.
I'm afraid that however much we like to believe that only ignorance leads to hate, it is only true for the truly ignorant.
by puzzled on November 27th, 2009
Don't pay too much attention to Theby sooz74. She has a habit of insulting anyone who doesn't agree with her or who is more intelligent than she is. You know when you don't get any response from her that the discussion has gone way above her head. If she thinks she has support from anyone then she will attack whether it is logical or not.
by Bohemian is back on November 27th, 2009
Gotcha, good to know! Thanks again. Fairly new to this site and have been put in my place a couple of times for treading in waters restricted to more seasoned members ("step down newby") so am probably a bit more sensitive than necessary! :)
Puzzled - my comments were very long winded and I would not expect anyone to read through all of my ramblings, but I in no way suggested that only ignorance leads to hate. I clearly stated that I agee with you that such feelings of course can and do come through education and knowledge. I made the distiction between those whose feelings and views stem from an intellectual understanding vs those who know absolutely nothing about the subject their feelings are directed toward. Both types exist, not one or the other. My comments were to clarify my belief and understanding of this and to be clear I was only talking about those with ignorance. I will not counteract your low blow insult based on an unfounded accusation.
by sooz74 on November 27th, 2009
SOOZ WRITES: "When asked to provide an argument for their beliefs, they either have nothing to say, or spew misinformation, false stereotypes, and generalizations that have been fed to them by others"
Islam hates, homos, Jews, Christians, Hindus, 'natural religionsts', atheists, and anyone who disagrees. The goal of Islam is to subjugate and eliminate all these groups.
Which group is the group that hates?
by Declic on November 28th, 2009
OK Sooz np. Welcome Hugz. It wasn't a low blow but a true statement. I've had a bellyfull of affluent liberals telling us rednecks how to live their lives.
Chicken on Rye
by puzzled on November 29th, 2009
Sooz, please don't think any challenge to a thought is a rejection of you as a very fine, kind and noble person. We are all learning.
Respectfully yours.
by Declic on November 29th, 2009
Thank you - I appreciate that and know that disagreement or challenging what I say does not equal rejection. I am a big girl and have a healthy amount of self-confidence. I welcome opposing views - I enjoy the challenge of a debate and often it is an opportunity to learn something new or see something from a perspective one otherwise would not. Regarding this exchange, I think there was a lot of misunderstanding and varying interpretation - no big deal, it happens. All I was bothered by and admittedly defensive about, was my intent, meaning, and beliefs being verbalized by others based on their assumptions and speculation. To me this is more about judgment (judgment not based on who I am or what I believe but rather who one imagines I am and what I believe) than it is a challenge.
Tone is lost here, so I want to say I my intent is not to antagonize at all.
by sooz74 on December 1st, 2009